This health care reform debate is crazy!
08-13-2009, 02:53 PM
#182
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Originally Posted by DRANGED' post='975361' date='Aug 13 2009, 12:43 PM
You are wrong, people will run to use health care that they previously could not afford. People won't run out and break a leg, but they will go in for minor issues they could not afford previously. Port wine stains, mole removal, erectile disfunction(C's Bimmer), hair loss, you name it.
Insurance companies are forced to cover pretty much everything, things that most of will never use. This is part of the high cost. We are not allowed to shop individual insurance policies across state lines, this is part of the high cost. Malpractice suits are a part of high cost. Illegal immigrants are part of the high cost. Ignorant people going to the hospital for a cold are part of the high cost. Non-paying customers are part of the high cost.
We should be allowed to buy insurance ala carte. Pay for what we need, not for what we don't.
Competition is not the problem, there are over 380 different health insurance companies in the US.
You know who keeps us from these cheaper alternatives? It's not the insurance companies, it is GOV'T.
Insurance companies are forced to cover pretty much everything, things that most of will never use. This is part of the high cost. We are not allowed to shop individual insurance policies across state lines, this is part of the high cost. Malpractice suits are a part of high cost. Illegal immigrants are part of the high cost. Ignorant people going to the hospital for a cold are part of the high cost. Non-paying customers are part of the high cost.
We should be allowed to buy insurance ala carte. Pay for what we need, not for what we don't.
Competition is not the problem, there are over 380 different health insurance companies in the US.
You know who keeps us from these cheaper alternatives? It's not the insurance companies, it is GOV'T.
As for people getting care that they previously did not? That's what it's all about. If there is a medical need underlying any of the symptoms you highlighted, it is entirely legitimate that there is a public option to treat it. It is also entirely legitimate that such matters are properly prioritized and do not take precedence over more medically pressing matters (and precedence should be governed by the opinion of a physician, not an insurer). Finally, it is also entirely legitimate that there are other options, such as private insurance, to enable those that can and want to pay extra to get better and/or quicker care.
And, in essence, that's really what the current proposals are trying to achieve. If you choose to believe otherwise, then none of us here have any business or much interest in trying to convince you otherwise.
To also respond to a later post about your perception that people aren't able to refute your argument: it's close to impossible to refute opinion, guesses, rhetoric and conjecture. Because that's really what you're posting...
08-13-2009, 03:52 PM
#184
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not racist, bigoted maybe but c'mon let a person talk, censorship is un american, and this and thats racist is besides the point! which she clearly has one. statement are said to provoke passion in a response which she clearly has, lighten up! do you get all fired up when you watch carlos mencia as well? and yes im just defending her cuz she's "just a girl!" 
Its proven that there were more first time black voters than any other demographic. John had posted that 96% of black people voted for Obama. Would a record number of black people came out to vote for two white people running for president? I dont think so, and if you think that is racist then i dont care.
If it is an emergency it is treated as "in network" as you have no choice. It's quite an easy argument with insurance companies. If it's not an emergency, then feel free to call a relative or a friend to drive you where you need to go. I've had someone come from Canada to the US for an open heart surgery because they were on a waiting list there. I've also had someone who broke their leg in New Orleans (while helping with the cleanup) choose to have their co-workers drive them to Indiana for the surgery. It's a CHOICE.
Originally Posted by pjinca' post='975428' date='Aug 13 2009, 03:53 PM
Funny herpes and HIV are free and i'm in no rush to get them. Even cancer is free and amazingly I have so far been able to resist the temptation. Interesting
Whats funny is you talk about being american first. Yet you make jokes about whitey's, and you bash the president of our country. Then you said the VA wont cover your knee's because it wasnt job related. Instead of waiting for a government handout why dont you sell that 30-50 thousand dollar car?? Your health should come before your car, shouldnt it? So you can live in the nice house, drive the nice car, have expensive things, but cant pay to get your knee's checked out or fixed.
Sounds about right....you make the bed you sleep in every night with the choices YOU make!
08-13-2009, 03:55 PM
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If you choose to believe otherwise, then none of us here have any business or much interest in trying to convince you otherwise.
To also respond to a later post about your perception that people aren't able to refute your argument: it's close to impossible to refute opinion, guesses, rhetoric and conjecture. Because that's really what you're posting...
To also respond to a later post about your perception that people aren't able to refute your argument: it's close to impossible to refute opinion, guesses, rhetoric and conjecture. Because that's really what you're posting...
08-13-2009, 04:00 PM
#186
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This is where we stood in 2000. Unfortunately the WHO no longer compiles these, but my feeling is that we haven't changed much. Are we really better off at number 37?
http://www.photius.com/rankings/healthranks.html
http://www.photius.com/rankings/healthranks.html
08-13-2009, 04:01 PM
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Originally Posted by DRANGED' post='975288' date='Aug 13 2009, 01:36 PM
"A government big enough to give you everything you want, is strong enough to take everything you have." Gerald Ford, Address to a Joint Session of Congress August 12, 1974
08-13-2009, 04:15 PM
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Originally Posted by DRANGED' post='975669' date='Aug 13 2009, 04:55 PM
Dissappointing...you're better than that.
), and many of the arguments on both sides of the fence are impossible to counter as they're not really based on anything other than rhetoric... I will, however, add that I believe that the level of misinformation, obfuscation and sleight of hand is much greater on the no-change side of the fence than the on pro-change side. I'll post a suitably egregious example a little later tonight.
08-13-2009, 09:10 PM
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Originally Posted by Alpine White Girl' post='975667' date='Aug 13 2009, 04:52 PM
I wasnt able to read this thread since last night but it was nice coming home and reading how bad Dranged dismantled your post. After reading a lot of your post it honestly makes me want
Whats funny is you talk about being american first. Yet you make jokes about whitey's, and you bash the president of our country. Then you said the VA wont cover your knee's because it wasnt job related. Instead of waiting for a government handout why dont you sell that 30-50 thousand dollar car?? Your health should come before your car, shouldnt it? So you can live in the nice house, drive the nice car, have expensive things, but cant pay to get your knee's checked out or fixed. Sounds about right....you make the bed you sleep in every night with the choices YOU make!
Whats funny is you talk about being american first. Yet you make jokes about whitey's, and you bash the president of our country. Then you said the VA wont cover your knee's because it wasnt job related. Instead of waiting for a government handout why dont you sell that 30-50 thousand dollar car?? Your health should come before your car, shouldnt it? So you can live in the nice house, drive the nice car, have expensive things, but cant pay to get your knee's checked out or fixed.
Sounds about right....you make the bed you sleep in every night with the choices YOU make!All I have left to say to you is read my new SIG
made it just for the small minded, enjoy and 100 points if you can figure out who wrote it - good luck 
Warning may require reading
08-13-2009, 09:24 PM
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TO Swajames:
I read this today and found it appropriate
The hardest part about gaining any new idea is sweeping out the
false idea occupying that niche. As long as that niche is occupied,
evidence and proof and logical demonstration get nowhere.
But once the niche is emptied of the wrong idea that has been
filling it - once you can honestly say, I don't know,
then it becomes possible to get at the truth.
I read this today and found it appropriate
The hardest part about gaining any new idea is sweeping out the
false idea occupying that niche. As long as that niche is occupied,
evidence and proof and logical demonstration get nowhere.
But once the niche is emptied of the wrong idea that has been
filling it - once you can honestly say, I don't know,
then it becomes possible to get at the truth.