Engine Oil Questions
03-27-2013, 03:03 PM
#21
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And let's not forget that there are negotiated "endorsement" fees paid to auto manufacturers by oil suppliers so in many instances it is near impossible to determine whether a given synthetic oil brand/formulation is not recommended simply because the supplier won't play that game. I sincerely doubt that my 550i gives one wit whether I'm using an un-recommended 0w-40 or 5w-30 as long as it is fully synthetic.
03-27-2013, 03:09 PM
#22
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Really just about any good synthetic, and many high quality dino oils (group 3 hydroprocessed), will do the job.
The key is changing the oil before the additives are gone. You can use $50 a quart boutique oil, but if you run it past the life of the additives the oil stops doing its job.
Engines don't live by miles but rather hours of operation. Going a mile at 60mph (one minute) is a world of difference from going a mile at 5mph (12 minutes) in stop and go traffic.
I too like M1 0W-40 as a "light" 40 grade for running hard in the desert mountains, but the actual wear differences between it and other synthetics are probably minimal.
Do I believe all drivers can go 15K miles on Mobil 1 EP? No way. If you do all highway miles maybe, but is it really worth the risk?
The difference between oil changes every 6K miles and oil changes every 15K miles works out to a cup of Starbuck's coffee per week. Cheap insurance I say!
The key is changing the oil before the additives are gone. You can use $50 a quart boutique oil, but if you run it past the life of the additives the oil stops doing its job.
Engines don't live by miles but rather hours of operation. Going a mile at 60mph (one minute) is a world of difference from going a mile at 5mph (12 minutes) in stop and go traffic.
I too like M1 0W-40 as a "light" 40 grade for running hard in the desert mountains, but the actual wear differences between it and other synthetics are probably minimal.
Do I believe all drivers can go 15K miles on Mobil 1 EP? No way. If you do all highway miles maybe, but is it really worth the risk?
The difference between oil changes every 6K miles and oil changes every 15K miles works out to a cup of Starbuck's coffee per week. Cheap insurance I say!
03-28-2013, 04:55 AM
#23
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My Ride: 2005 545i Sport
The most objective measure of actual engine oil performance is the HTHS figure.
I think marketing claims that emphasize: "15,000 miles, Extended Performance" is meaningless hype.
HTHS is a balance between fuel economy and protection. Too high of an HTHS and you lower fuel economy, too low, and you reduce wear protection.
Within the oil industry, the big issue is with low HTHS figures (those below 3.5). As Lubrizol states:
A critical issue for the oil industry is how misapplication of low HTHS viscosity oils will be avoided. The use of low HTHS oils will save fuel in engines designed for their use but could lead to excessive premature wear in some engines.
Engine manufacturers are evaluating their hardware to see if engine durability, especially for ring and liner scuffing is an issue with low HTHS viscosity oils so they can take advantage of the engine lubricant delivering improved FE to meet the new US Environmental Protection Agency (EPA) and National Highway Traffic Safety Administration (NHTSA) FE and GHG requirements
So, if you're trying to squeeze every mile out of your gallon of gas, then go with a sub 3.5 HTHS oil, if you're most concerned about wear on the internal components, then seek out an oil with >3.5 HTHS.
Why offer <3.5 HTHS oils?
The drivers behind lowering HTHS viscosity are new global governmental regulations to improve fuel economy (FE) and lower greenhouse gases (GHG) in new vehicles. Lower HTHS viscosity tends to improve FE and lower GHG but higher HTHS viscosity affords better wear protection so a careful balance must be found when formulating an engine oil.
I think marketing claims that emphasize: "15,000 miles, Extended Performance" is meaningless hype.
HTHS is a balance between fuel economy and protection. Too high of an HTHS and you lower fuel economy, too low, and you reduce wear protection.
Within the oil industry, the big issue is with low HTHS figures (those below 3.5). As Lubrizol states:
A critical issue for the oil industry is how misapplication of low HTHS viscosity oils will be avoided. The use of low HTHS oils will save fuel in engines designed for their use but could lead to excessive premature wear in some engines.
Engine manufacturers are evaluating their hardware to see if engine durability, especially for ring and liner scuffing is an issue with low HTHS viscosity oils so they can take advantage of the engine lubricant delivering improved FE to meet the new US Environmental Protection Agency (EPA) and National Highway Traffic Safety Administration (NHTSA) FE and GHG requirements
So, if you're trying to squeeze every mile out of your gallon of gas, then go with a sub 3.5 HTHS oil, if you're most concerned about wear on the internal components, then seek out an oil with >3.5 HTHS.
Why offer <3.5 HTHS oils?
The drivers behind lowering HTHS viscosity are new global governmental regulations to improve fuel economy (FE) and lower greenhouse gases (GHG) in new vehicles. Lower HTHS viscosity tends to improve FE and lower GHG but higher HTHS viscosity affords better wear protection so a careful balance must be found when formulating an engine oil.
03-28-2013, 05:02 AM
#24
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BMW LL-01 spec's requires oils that are > 3.5 HTHS.
That is why only Mobil 1 0W-40 meets the LL-01 standard.
Avoid any oil with the FE designation "Fuel Economy" on the packaging.
You are guaranteed an oil that will fall well below the 3.5 HTHS number set by BMW.
That is why only Mobil 1 0W-40 meets the LL-01 standard.
Avoid any oil with the FE designation "Fuel Economy" on the packaging.
You are guaranteed an oil that will fall well below the 3.5 HTHS number set by BMW.
Last edited by paran; 03-28-2013 at 05:07 AM.
04-01-2013, 01:46 PM
#25
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Great!
In my bike it's recommended for 10w-40. Since day 1 I have used 20w-50. Why? Because I live in a hot climate and I put the engine through rough riding conditions. I do not use synthetical oils due to it being a wet clutch. I do not even attempt a syn-blend. I change every 3K or so. Why? I ride normally and shift at 8K RPM. When I put it to the test which is 80% of my riding I shift at 13K RPM. The bike hits 115 MPH in 2nd gear in a matter of seconds. Because the bike is both liquid and air -cooled combined with the temperatures in Florida it is better to have thicker oil. I highly doubt anyone here needs to worry about using a fully syn 5-30 over a fully syn 0-40, BMW or not. Your car's electronics will fail you eventually beyond a cost you're willing to pay or your car will be stolen, totaled, flooded etc. before the engine will give out on you. Baby it all you want. Nothing lasts forever.
We all know about oil and life now... can we move on?
In my bike it's recommended for 10w-40. Since day 1 I have used 20w-50. Why? Because I live in a hot climate and I put the engine through rough riding conditions. I do not use synthetical oils due to it being a wet clutch. I do not even attempt a syn-blend. I change every 3K or so. Why? I ride normally and shift at 8K RPM. When I put it to the test which is 80% of my riding I shift at 13K RPM. The bike hits 115 MPH in 2nd gear in a matter of seconds. Because the bike is both liquid and air -cooled combined with the temperatures in Florida it is better to have thicker oil. I highly doubt anyone here needs to worry about using a fully syn 5-30 over a fully syn 0-40, BMW or not. Your car's electronics will fail you eventually beyond a cost you're willing to pay or your car will be stolen, totaled, flooded etc. before the engine will give out on you. Baby it all you want. Nothing lasts forever.
We all know about oil and life now... can we move on?
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