zag

guys.... what is the plan to zoom up north to clear carbon? anyone?

wah..so many complains on PML and soooo many e60s on the road, stop at junction look left look right look in front and behind.. e60s all over the place. if BMW AG rolled out shitty quality cars.. PML is picking up the shit. the more they sell the more noise we heard. Poor PML biting off more than they can chew!

my car is coming to 3 years... the 3rd year itch is dreadful...keep another year and deal with potential out of warranty part start breaking down or cross finger roll another one out of the PML showroom and hope no lemon or friday car.

in the course of owning the very first batch e60 since Nov 2003, these have been fixed or replaced under warranty.. what do you guys think? a mix of cosmetic vs. serious ones.

- brake pads - (noisy)
- starter motor (clutch overun)
- timing belt (noisy)
- door trims; dash trim (delamination)
- comfort seat thigh rest molding (delamination)
- front pillar molding trim (delamination)
- front rocker arm (bushing torn)
-rear wish bone arm (bushing torn)
- wiper blades (noisy) changed 3 times
- premature run flat tyres worn
- rear shade (sticky)
- turning light stalk (buzzing)
- door creaks - frigging hi tech tape fix (shame on BMW being hi tech car)
- front carriage creaks (3 times before fully fixed)
- replace blown engine thermostat (this is the most serious one- coz engine overheating warning came on)
- replaced one of the 166 rims - scratched by foreman in the workshop

All the above has been relatively painless with Charles working it out for me.

There are still a couple of nagging noises here and there,, but sometimes i just turn my sensitivity down one notch and tell myself not to sweat over it. Life is short!

Edlee

I'm back!!! I was down at Kg Arang this morning. Met Torsten who was with another German, presumably to look at both my 545 and Fireplace's 525. Frankly, I've got confidence in Torsten so far. I believe they, as most other Europeans, will do a better analysis on the faults. I won't believe the older generation LOCAL MANAGERS at PML. Ask them about the 2002TI and I'm sure they know alot. Ask them about the ECU of the E60 and I'm pretty sure they'll have to read this forum before they understand what is being asked. They just don't make the cut and that is why I prefer to speak with people like Dennis, Paul and Jeff Vasaloo; the people on the ground.

Just don't give up hope yet; I've got three hundred over reasons not to, and Fireplace, you've got two hundred odd reasons to do the same.

My sales person called me today to soothe things over, but I told her only one thing. Get it repaired once and for all or like LMK said, I'll not be back.

I'll be checking freight prices with my China agent tomorrow. Will keep you guys posted.

Edlee

I'm game!!! The M6 is now 4900Km. Another day or two and I'll be able to unleash her full potential!!!
Just hope she doesn't breakdown along the way

Olivin530i

Hi Zag,

My ride is turning 2 in a week's time and I do register similar concerns. PML is selling and after clearing the AA batch has started to move the IMF ones I heard; question is, can their limited resources cope?

Far too often, parts which we need may take 3 days or more to reach (from Johor PDC?) and we ended up wasting precious time with workshop visits.

I just collected my ride after the 3rd Oil service. She went in with 15 problems to "cure" and was returned after 9 days with faults still present.

Delamination (peeling) only makes the interior look cheap - I have had half a dozen parts replaced or pending replacement. Frank Zauner could not give me an assurance of what BMW AG will do to ensure these coatings which are supposed to make the plastic look richer outlast similar ones found in Jap cars!

Yes the freaking anti-friction tape - they currently have NO SOLUTION to the problem despite my changing to supposedly New Seals. It is strange that the 520 loaner from Hertz don't have this problem; in fact, the doors close with a firmer "thump".

I have for the past few months being plague with the rear doors not locking after driving off. The 2 front doors lock alright, but the rears (both) would only lock intermittently. They have suspected it could be the key but when I swop with the spare, the problem persisted. Now, they are discussing if they should change the Car Access System (CAS).

Runflat tires wearing unevenly - I am asking PML what to do with this 2nd set of Dumplops which is again wearing in the inner. They did a wheel alignment and didn't think it was that bad to cause (or are they hiding the facts - I can't tell) the problem. Torsten is supposed to get back to me tomorrow as to whether they would replace or compensate.

Me too had the rear shades replaced when the car was pretty new - it was also sticky!

BTW, did you get the part (next to the charcoal filter) which is available on later cars? I asked the parts people and they cannot find it despite my providing the part number. They are still on it and will revert.

Well, my verdict of CIP 20.02 - its not that bad leh! Maybe after being on a 520 for 9 days, the 530 is a change.

nuvi360

yo,

my very first bmw was a lemon, my second had flaws and yet im back for my third and current ride (also not flawless), because nothing else beats the handling (in the same price tag).

if i can live with the flaws i will drive on and enjoy my UDM.

sod the after sales, why let those imbecils spoil and drive you away from UDM

have kept my cars for an averge of 3.5 years, its not keeps forever.

ask your self ..why did you get a bmw in the fisrt place??for me its that in line 6 and good handling....definately not for the service.


every other make has its fair share of defects and poor service too. its just how you see it and take it. no point stressing over it.

i was talking to one of my patient the other day who happened to be a pml mechanic (i did not tell him i drive a beemer),he says customers are always complaning and they are having a real hard time from their superiors until they are so fed they also cant be bother.guess we have to put our selves in their shoes.

but i do share your disappointments

no offence to any one just my thoughts.


(cant decide to post or not)

russo

26th March. Malacca and back. Anybody?

Edlee

I'm on!!!

Fireplace

Mr final letter to Robert Friend, and frankly, I still swear by BMW for its sheer driving pleasure and performance. Flaws and problems are bound to increase with more technology and feautres built into the car of today and the future. I am sure this is just the tip of the iceberg, and hopefully, they get around with the quality controls and competencies of the service staff to truly make BMW the UDM.

Honestly, the hissing sound is minor but I just can't swallow it when they so conveniently write-off any flaw as "characteristic" of the car. I am barking them because they fail to engage this matter in ways that satisfy the customers. Definitely, I can't argue the car is a lemon but I certainly can't accept their choice of reasoning. They maybe correct in their claim but they may have digged themselve a grave in the way they handle my issue. I don't feel I should sit quiet and not fight for the $ i pay PML for their over inflated car price, and get a less then perfect machinery. So, here goes...

Mr Robert Friend,

I understand BMW Asia has for the second time declared the gear transmission hissing sound of my 525 as ?normal characteristic? of the model, and that there is no further action given their conclusion. Through Mr Dennis Sim, I acknowledged the findings but continue to reject the reason given to me.

My position as stated in my earlier mail to you remains. I cannot accept the current status of the car. My rejection is based on the following rationale:

1) It is utterly unusual to have a brand new, prestige car with a hissing noise that is evidently not present in any modern prestige cars, including other BMW new models on the road today.

2) There is no solid conclusion that other 525s of a representative scale would have similar so-called ?characteristic? hissing sound. I would like to see BMW make an official & public declaration that E60 525s emits similar ?characteristic? hissing sound, and that my 525 is of no exception.

3) PML Sales Department failed to inform me of such extraordinary gear box hissing sound that is so-called inherent in the 525s but not on other 5 series models, and that I would not have selected this model in my purchase if I was properly informed.

4) PML service department, through Mr Jeffery Lau in the presence of Chin, linked the hissing sound problem to the gear selector unit when I first brought up the issue and in his own words assured me with 110% confidence that it can be eradicated. He subsequently ordered the original factory fitted part to be replaced. Clearly, PML?s experienced and senior Service Team did not think the hissing sound is inherent in nature. In this instance, the brand new and original factory fitted part in good working condition was replaced unnecessary. Such is a clear negligence on PML part in diagnosing the problem and hence fixing the wrong thing, causing the brand new value and condition (perceived and/or actual) of my car to suffer with unnecessary repairs.

Although there maybe no noticeable impact on the performance, drivability, roadworthiness of the car; built quality, innovations, component designs & fittings do form the selling price of the new car. In this instance, it?s a $210,000 investment and it is unjustifiable for BMW to write off the imperfection and flaw as ?normal characteristic? of the car.

As an analogy, if one spent thousands of dollars investing in an expensive timepiece such as a Rolex, only to have the watch emit louder than usual ticking sound and that such ticking sound is not present in the other Rolex models but the manufacturer claimed that it is ?characteristic? of the particular model only. It sure does not speak well in terms of brand equity and image, not to mention angry customer rejecting the timepiece and seeking a refund.

This issue is clearly not resolved. I would continue to demand PML and BMW to make good this matter before I pursue next course of actions. I understand you are leaving PML soon and I demand an amicable resolution before 31 March 2006. Given that you are departing PML, I would request that this matter be copied to your superior for reference and follow through. I look forward to hearing from you very soon. Thank you

Edlee

Wow!!! A rather large can of worms has just been opened!!! At the end of the day, its your money. The choice is always yours. Nobody forced anybody to buy a BMW or a Merc or a Lexus.

For me, I'd rather just quietly walk away from it all. No point voicing concerns to a Company that refuses to change. No point throwing away good money to invite stress. Why, the service good people at Alexandra all love me. I'm sure if I were to walk in to the service counter tomorrow, everyone of the CSO would run the 100m faster than Carl Lewis (away from me; as if I was infected with SARS) So at the end of the day, I asked myself; why bother? Why make yourself known as a difficult customer? Why become so notorious? Just walk away from it all.

I'd rather buy a 82K Korean car and live with the problems knowing I get what I am paying for than pay 317K for a then top of the range E60 German car expecting the best but end up receiving nothing I expect and live my days cursing my decision. I've been very fair; told my sales rep that this is THE last chance to get the problem (which incidentally began from the first day I had the 545) sorted out or erase my phone number from her ph address book.

tategoi

Its ok to post, no offence. This is a forum we voice freely. But I don't agree with the rants of your patient. Why are do BMW owners were complaining in the first place? If the mechanics and all at PML and BMW did a good job in solving our problems, would we complain unnecessaily? It may not be the sole faults of the mechanics, perhaps they can't cope with the huge workload, or maybe they did not go through proper training, that I don't know. I won't put myself in his shoe, because that that is not my job, I am not paid to be a PML mechanic, he is paid for the job, and thus he had to wear his own shoes.

However, I totally agree with you on your first point that BMW is indeed the ultimate driving machine. I still have that silly grins on my face when driving my 520, and I won't let those mechanics and whoever in PML/BMW wipe those away from me.