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07-23-2006, 12:18 PM
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Originally Posted by ats77' post='314034' date='Jul 22 2006, 04:53 PM
I am sorry guys you in the "cradle of new democracy" I do understand admin's decission will not judge it, But for me in Europe it is strange that you mention you did above 100mph when normally it is banned in the States. So this whole thing is 
07-23-2006, 03:40 PM
#42
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Originally Posted by jiio' post='313945' date='Jul 22 2006, 01:08 PM
I think I understand what Lomag is saying. Kill threads, spirited driving, what have you... will not be deleted or closed as long as it's individualized. For example, from time to time when I write about my runs with other cars that is acceptable. What will not acceptable or be condoned is an ongoing thread that lists all the kills. So, I'm guessing we will not be seeing another "5-Series Offical Kill" thread, but the admins will let pass individual kill threads. Do I get that right, Lomag?
To put it bluntly, if any thread becomes a problem (as judged by das and/or I), it's going to be delt with with the way we (das and/or I) see fit. We really don't care who started the thread. Our actions aren't going to please everyone, that's life. The key point is, we're not going to intervene very often, when it happens, accept it, and move on.
Please.
07-23-2006, 05:46 PM
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Originally Posted by Lomag' post='314297' date='Jul 23 2006, 06:40 PM
jiio understood what I said and summarized it pretty well above. Give that a re-read. Your blatent mis-interpretation of my response makes me wonder if you're just bitter because it was your thread which was closed. If it was someone elses thread I gather that you would careless. If that's the case rest assured I have no problems with you personally. Your posts are great, but that particular thread just wasn't acceptable any longer the way it was going.
To put it bluntly, if any thread becomes a problem (as judged by das and/or I), it's going to be delt with with the way we (das and/or I) see fit. We really don't care who started the thread. Our actions aren't going to please everyone, that's life. The key point is, we're not going to intervene very often, when it happens, accept it, and move on.
Please.
To put it bluntly, if any thread becomes a problem (as judged by das and/or I), it's going to be delt with with the way we (das and/or I) see fit. We really don't care who started the thread. Our actions aren't going to please everyone, that's life. The key point is, we're not going to intervene very often, when it happens, accept it, and move on.
Please.
"I think I understand what Lomag is saying. Kill threads, spirited driving, what have you... will not be deleted or closed as long as it's individualized. For example, from time to time when I write about my runs with other cars that is acceptable. What will not acceptable or be condoned is an ongoing thread that lists all the kills. So, I'm guessing we will not be seeing another "5-Series Offical Kill" thread, but the admins will let pass individual kill threads. Do I get that right, Lomag?"
I had the same uncertainties he did after I read your reply. Why don't you ask jiio if he understood you clearly if the uncertainties pointed to above are not sufficient for you arrive at this conclusion.
You say:
"Give that a re-read. Your blatent mis-interpretation of my response makes me wonder if you're just bitter because it was your thread which was closed."
What was my blantant misinterpretation? If my reply hints of misinterpretation, then it is because I, like the others, did not understand you totally--not because I was attempting to misinterpret you blatantly. IMO, you are being quite disrespectful and have not really read my posts on this thread carefully--following them one after another. Incidentally, I am not bitter about anything in my life. That's right nothing. I can't imagine why any one would be bitter over a thread on a discussion board. Give me a break. Accusing me as being bitter about a closed thread is the same thing as saying I am petty about inconsequential things.
You say:
"If it was someone elses thread I gather that you would careless. If that's the case rest assured I have no problems with you personally. Your posts are great, but that particular thread just wasn't acceptable any longer the way it was going."
You misjudge me very seriously and in a very insulting way. I could care less about a thread of mine being closed. It should be clear from every post I have made in this thread, that I have only been trying to figure out what principles you have been applying in closing threads and what principles you will be applying in the future. Be sure that I will not care in the least if you close all of my threads if you want. You request that I reread. I have reread your posts on this thread numerous time to try to figure out what you were saying. Until now, none of us could be certain despite your claim to the contrary.
Your comments about me, my misinterpretations, my bitterness, my selfishness about "my posts" are totally unappreciated and even more inaccurate. :thumbsdown: I suggest that we discuss posts and not attempt to draw inferences about the personalities and intentions of others. I think that if you reread your posts and our replies, then you will see how your posts left room for interpretation, issues unresolved, and uncertainties in our minds.
07-23-2006, 07:00 PM
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Originally Posted by Rudy' post='314332' date='Jul 23 2006, 09:42 PM
07-23-2006, 07:34 PM
#46
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This is unbelievable. You have a great ability to alter the truth to fit your own mold. My goodness gracious. You're not a politician or a lawyer are you?
So, lets begin.
Well, in my response I ended by saying Now I personally don't mind "kill" story threads but condoning such actions is not what we want to do. and in your reply you say "You don't want to see any more kills-type threads no matter how they are worded or what precautions we take in ensuring only "proper" content.". I basically said I don't mind them and you go on to say that I don't want to see any kill threads?? That's what I'd call a blatant misinterpretation because first it's obvious and second because you then go on and scold me for not closing all the other threads about kills. That also led me to believe you were upset that I closed only your thread. You follow my line of thinking here?
Well, I'm sorry. I'm only going by my interpretation of what you write. Now, you could careless about your thread being closed? Well, then WHY are you arguing with the admin right now? Not speak for Rudy but he's probably wondering the same thing with that sad face remark you've asked about. You see, most people tend not to argue with authority figures. What good can come of it?
Again, for the 4th or 5th time I ask if we can please move on. Just FYI, I'm not going to go on arguing with you. There's no use. I am a man of peace, not a man of war. Cease-fire, okay?
And just FYI again, this entire thread is probably going to be deleted. It serves no purpose. I'll go over that with Dave when he gets back tommorrow or Tuesday when I next see him.
So, lets begin.
You say:
"Give that a re-read. Your blatent mis-interpretation of my response makes me wonder if you're just bitter because it was your thread which was closed."
What was my blantant misinterpretation? If my reply hints of misinterpretation, then it is because I, like the others, did not understand you totally--not because I was attempting to misinterpret you blatantly. IMO, you are being quite disrespectful and have not really read my posts on this thread carefully--following them one after another. Incidentally, I am not bitter about anything in my life. That's right nothing. I can't imagine why any one would be bitter over a thread on a discussion board. Give me a break. Accusing me as being bitter about a closed thread is the same thing as saying I am petty about inconsequential things.
"Give that a re-read. Your blatent mis-interpretation of my response makes me wonder if you're just bitter because it was your thread which was closed."
What was my blantant misinterpretation? If my reply hints of misinterpretation, then it is because I, like the others, did not understand you totally--not because I was attempting to misinterpret you blatantly. IMO, you are being quite disrespectful and have not really read my posts on this thread carefully--following them one after another. Incidentally, I am not bitter about anything in my life. That's right nothing. I can't imagine why any one would be bitter over a thread on a discussion board. Give me a break. Accusing me as being bitter about a closed thread is the same thing as saying I am petty about inconsequential things.
Originally Posted by Znod' post='314319' date='Jul 23 2006, 09:46 PM
You say:
"If it was someone elses thread I gather that you would careless. If that's the case rest assured I have no problems with you personally. Your posts are great, but that particular thread just wasn't acceptable any longer the way it was going."
You misjudge me very seriously and in a very insulting way. I could care less about a thread of mine being closed. It should be clear from every post I have made in this thread, that I have only been trying to figure out what principles you have been applying in closing threads and what principles you will be applying in the future. Be sure that I will not care in the least if you close all of my threads if you want. You request that I reread. I have reread your posts on this thread numerous time to try to figure out what you were saying. Until now, none of us could be certain despite your claim to the contrary.
Your comments about me, my misinterpretations, my bitterness, my selfishness about "my posts" are totally unappreciated and even more inaccurate. :thumbsdown: I suggest that we discuss posts and not attempt to draw inferences about the personalities and intentions of others. I think that if you reread your posts and our replies, then you will see how your posts left room for interpretation, issues unresolved, and uncertainties in our minds.
"If it was someone elses thread I gather that you would careless. If that's the case rest assured I have no problems with you personally. Your posts are great, but that particular thread just wasn't acceptable any longer the way it was going."
You misjudge me very seriously and in a very insulting way. I could care less about a thread of mine being closed. It should be clear from every post I have made in this thread, that I have only been trying to figure out what principles you have been applying in closing threads and what principles you will be applying in the future. Be sure that I will not care in the least if you close all of my threads if you want. You request that I reread. I have reread your posts on this thread numerous time to try to figure out what you were saying. Until now, none of us could be certain despite your claim to the contrary.
Your comments about me, my misinterpretations, my bitterness, my selfishness about "my posts" are totally unappreciated and even more inaccurate. :thumbsdown: I suggest that we discuss posts and not attempt to draw inferences about the personalities and intentions of others. I think that if you reread your posts and our replies, then you will see how your posts left room for interpretation, issues unresolved, and uncertainties in our minds.
Again, for the 4th or 5th time I ask if we can please move on. Just FYI, I'm not going to go on arguing with you. There's no use. I am a man of peace, not a man of war. Cease-fire, okay?
And just FYI again, this entire thread is probably going to be deleted. It serves no purpose. I'll go over that with Dave when he gets back tommorrow or Tuesday when I next see him.
07-23-2006, 08:24 PM
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Well, I'm sorry. I'm only going by my interpretation of what you write. Now, you could careless about your thread being closed? Well, then WHY are you arguing with the admin right now? Not speak for Rudy but he's probably wondering the same thing with that sad face remark you've asked about. You see, most people tend not to argue with authority figures. What good can come of it?
Why is Rudy arguing with me without saying anything? I had no argument with Rudy until he indicated disagreement without giving any specifics.
And, OK, give me a try; just close any of my threads that violate the rules your now have stated clearly. I won't care even a little bit. I care about issues and principles not about threads being closed or not. You now have stated a policy so I will have no problem with what you do given that it is consistent with the policy, and I will gladly abide by the policy.
I always question and challenge authority when I believe authority is wrong, ambiguous, arbitrary etc. And, you are authority only because you have the power to ban. You ask, in effect, what is gained by questioninig and challenging authority. Well, it helped to finally get us out of Viet Nam. There now is a whistle-blowers law. We now have civil right legislation. Abortion is legal. The church does not rule the US. We impeached Nixon. Need I go on? and on? and on? How do you feel about the American revolution? Is has not yet worked in regard to Iraq, but the tide of public opinion has changed dramatically--some of which might be attributed to those who challenged authority.
I made my last reply was because I found what you said to be insulting and demeaning and because you think that your previous remarks had cleared everything up. Your final post would have cleared everything up for me. But, for some reason you decided to call my intentions into question and to make demeaning remarks about me.There was no point in doing so.
Again, for the 4th or 5th time I ask if we can please move on. Just FYI, I'm not going to go on arguing with you. There's no use. I am a man of peace, not a man of war. Cease-fire, okay?
Cease fire is fine, but I think I am owed a real apology--not one where you say you are sorry and then turn around and justify your remarks. You say you gave your interpretation of what I wrote. I have not given my interpretation of what you have written. I believe that doing so is completely inappropriate. People are too easy to misinterpret when all one sees is words on a page. I too am a man of peace, but I don't back down when pushed by authority or otherwise.
And just FYI again, this entire thread is probably going to be deleted. It serves no purpose. I'll go over that with Dave when he gets back tommorrow or Tuesday when I next see him.
Whatever. Apparently you think I would care. I now have clear answers to the questions, etc., I kept raising and that is all I wanted all along. I think the thread did have a purpose--providing these answers for all of us--even though 1 of us got it late--see below.
Why is Rudy arguing with me without saying anything? I had no argument with Rudy until he indicated disagreement without giving any specifics.
And, OK, give me a try; just close any of my threads that violate the rules your now have stated clearly. I won't care even a little bit. I care about issues and principles not about threads being closed or not. You now have stated a policy so I will have no problem with what you do given that it is consistent with the policy, and I will gladly abide by the policy.
I always question and challenge authority when I believe authority is wrong, ambiguous, arbitrary etc. And, you are authority only because you have the power to ban. You ask, in effect, what is gained by questioninig and challenging authority. Well, it helped to finally get us out of Viet Nam. There now is a whistle-blowers law. We now have civil right legislation. Abortion is legal. The church does not rule the US. We impeached Nixon. Need I go on? and on? and on? How do you feel about the American revolution? Is has not yet worked in regard to Iraq, but the tide of public opinion has changed dramatically--some of which might be attributed to those who challenged authority.
I made my last reply was because I found what you said to be insulting and demeaning and because you think that your previous remarks had cleared everything up. Your final post would have cleared everything up for me. But, for some reason you decided to call my intentions into question and to make demeaning remarks about me.There was no point in doing so.
Again, for the 4th or 5th time I ask if we can please move on. Just FYI, I'm not going to go on arguing with you. There's no use. I am a man of peace, not a man of war. Cease-fire, okay?
Cease fire is fine, but I think I am owed a real apology--not one where you say you are sorry and then turn around and justify your remarks. You say you gave your interpretation of what I wrote. I have not given my interpretation of what you have written. I believe that doing so is completely inappropriate. People are too easy to misinterpret when all one sees is words on a page. I too am a man of peace, but I don't back down when pushed by authority or otherwise.
And just FYI again, this entire thread is probably going to be deleted. It serves no purpose. I'll go over that with Dave when he gets back tommorrow or Tuesday when I next see him.
Whatever. Apparently you think I would care. I now have clear answers to the questions, etc., I kept raising and that is all I wanted all along. I think the thread did have a purpose--providing these answers for all of us--even though 1 of us got it late--see below.
07-23-2006, 08:51 PM
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Opps I didn't see all of this stuff.
Originally Posted by Lomag' post='314360' date='Jul 23 2006, 10:34 PM
This is unbelievable. You have a great ability to alter the truth to fit your own mold. My goodness gracious. You're not a politician or a lawyer are you? I am not a liar or a misconstruer. I don't alter truth to fit my needs. Even though you gave a , I also find your comment about altering the truth to be highly offensive. I may make mistakes, but I don't do decitful things.
So, lets begin.
There's no uncertainty. Since you apparently can't follow the thread let me summarize it for you. I find this remark to be insulting. Right under my post Busta posted and requested some clarity. Then jiio posted the summary you pasted above. andy545 posted that he agreed with jiio and most importantly, then I posted and said Yes that's right. Where's the uncertainty my friend? How much clearer can we get?
When I came back from the 2nd virus alert, I missed the post where you said "Yes, that's right." And, I continued to miss it until you just mentioned it. As I said, trying to infer someone's intentions and to make decsions about his or her character on the basis especially of non face-to-face conversaton is a bad idea. I simply didn't see the post. Think how easy is would have been simply to refer me to the post where you agreed with with what jiio said.
Well, in my response I ended by saying Now I personally don't mind "kill" story threads but condoning such actions is not what we want to do. and in your reply you say "You don't want to see any more kills-type threads no matter how they are worded or what precautions we take in ensuring only "proper" content.". I basically said I don't mind them and you go on to say that I don't want to see any kill threads?? That's what I'd call a blatant misinterpretation because first it's obvious and second because you then go on and scold me for not closing all the other threads about kills. That also led me to believe you were upset that I closed only your thread. You follow my line of thinking here?
Now, I don't understand again. I though you said no kills threads. So, I showed my understanding by saying: "You don't want to see any more kills-type threads no matter how they are worded or what precautions we take in ensuring only "proper" content." Am I wrong in what I said? Do you want to see more kills threads posted?
Also, I said "And, I have to ask if you are going to be consistent in dealing with other threads that also deal with unsafe and illegal activities on the streets. In this regard, there are "jillions" of threads that talk about going top speed, how fast I got it up to yesterday, spirited cornering on the streets, etc., etc. Will these threads also be closed now and when they appear in the future?"
I thought, at this point, you were saying that you don't condone any thread that deals with unsafe and illegal activities on the road. So, I was saying, in effect, well, OK, then all threads which deal with such activities ought to be closed--not just kills threads. This comment also arose from not seeing the reply I mentioned above. So, again, the easy way to deal will all of this would have ....
I am sure that you can see that all of what has gone on is a simple misunderstanding on both parts. There was no reason to question my intentions or character.
I apologize for not seeing your post and continuing to pursue my questions after I should have know the answers. I take full responsibility for not seeing your post. And, have a good night. I'll check back in the moring.
I am not a liar or a misconstruer. I don't alter truth to fit my needs. Even though you gave a , I also find your comment about altering the truth to be highly offensive. I may make mistakes, but I don't do decitful things.So, lets begin.
There's no uncertainty. Since you apparently can't follow the thread let me summarize it for you. I find this remark to be insulting. Right under my post Busta posted and requested some clarity. Then jiio posted the summary you pasted above. andy545 posted that he agreed with jiio and most importantly, then I posted and said Yes that's right. Where's the uncertainty my friend? How much clearer can we get?
When I came back from the 2nd virus alert, I missed the post where you said "Yes, that's right." And, I continued to miss it until you just mentioned it. As I said, trying to infer someone's intentions and to make decsions about his or her character on the basis especially of non face-to-face conversaton is a bad idea. I simply didn't see the post. Think how easy is would have been simply to refer me to the post where you agreed with with what jiio said.
Well, in my response I ended by saying Now I personally don't mind "kill" story threads but condoning such actions is not what we want to do. and in your reply you say "You don't want to see any more kills-type threads no matter how they are worded or what precautions we take in ensuring only "proper" content.". I basically said I don't mind them and you go on to say that I don't want to see any kill threads?? That's what I'd call a blatant misinterpretation because first it's obvious and second because you then go on and scold me for not closing all the other threads about kills. That also led me to believe you were upset that I closed only your thread. You follow my line of thinking here?
Now, I don't understand again. I though you said no kills threads. So, I showed my understanding by saying: "You don't want to see any more kills-type threads no matter how they are worded or what precautions we take in ensuring only "proper" content." Am I wrong in what I said? Do you want to see more kills threads posted?
Also, I said "And, I have to ask if you are going to be consistent in dealing with other threads that also deal with unsafe and illegal activities on the streets. In this regard, there are "jillions" of threads that talk about going top speed, how fast I got it up to yesterday, spirited cornering on the streets, etc., etc. Will these threads also be closed now and when they appear in the future?"
I thought, at this point, you were saying that you don't condone any thread that deals with unsafe and illegal activities on the road. So, I was saying, in effect, well, OK, then all threads which deal with such activities ought to be closed--not just kills threads. This comment also arose from not seeing the reply I mentioned above. So, again, the easy way to deal will all of this would have ....
I am sure that you can see that all of what has gone on is a simple misunderstanding on both parts. There was no reason to question my intentions or character.
I apologize for not seeing your post and continuing to pursue my questions after I should have know the answers. I take full responsibility for not seeing your post. And, have a good night. I'll check back in the moring.
07-24-2006, 12:42 AM
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OMG Zonod, really man you don't know when to quit do you?! I personally feel what Lomag did, and i just want to say that i am very very happy that we have the best admins in the wole world. I mean, i'm still a newbie through some "old" 
folks here but all that i saw was only perfect behaviour and actions by our admins.
I mean it's indiferent for me if the thread was closed or not since it didn't interested me so much.So please man, take a brake and quit it. Do smth better instead of arguing till the end of time. Many gave you the ideea before. Do that and just quit it.
LONG LIVE OUR ADMINS Lomag and Das !!!
folks here but all that i saw was only perfect behaviour and actions by our admins.I mean it's indiferent for me if the thread was closed or not since it didn't interested me so much.So please man, take a brake and quit it. Do smth better instead of arguing till the end of time. Many gave you the ideea before. Do that and just quit it.
LONG LIVE OUR ADMINS Lomag and Das !!!
07-24-2006, 03:17 AM
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Having recently checked out a number of other car forums I can say that the admin at e60.net are by far the best.
There is a lot of freedom on the forum and they rarely intervene, which I think is one of the main reasons why most members treat one another with a high degree of respect.
Many forums totally ban discussion of street racing for fear that they will be seen to condone it.
E60.net has taken a more relaxed approach, but I can certainly see that having a thread set-up specifically to discuss something illegal (and also extremely dangerous) would be undesirable.
So - I'm happy the thread has been closed and I am happy that we are all free to continue to post whatever we like.
Obviously if any post (racing or otherwise) is made which is over the top, then the admin chaps will intervene - that's completely fair.
We have no right to 'demand' anything - the forum would not exist without DAS and Lomaq's good grace, time, effort and bandwidth.
There is a lot of freedom on the forum and they rarely intervene, which I think is one of the main reasons why most members treat one another with a high degree of respect.
Many forums totally ban discussion of street racing for fear that they will be seen to condone it.
E60.net has taken a more relaxed approach, but I can certainly see that having a thread set-up specifically to discuss something illegal (and also extremely dangerous) would be undesirable.
So - I'm happy the thread has been closed and I am happy that we are all free to continue to post whatever we like.
Obviously if any post (racing or otherwise) is made which is over the top, then the admin chaps will intervene - that's completely fair.
We have no right to 'demand' anything - the forum would not exist without DAS and Lomaq's good grace, time, effort and bandwidth.