Found a UK (London) Software Coding Garage for retrofits
04-17-2009, 12:18 PM
#41
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Model Year: 2006
OK I've got hold of the SAM unit and even managed to look inside. Its quite a neat design, uses two relays and a 8-PIN FLASH-BASED 8-BIT CMOS MICROCONTROLLER 12F629. I'm guessing the later is being used to track all the button presses and other combinations and also to time the folding and unfolding cycles.
04-17-2009, 04:42 PM
#42
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Model Year: 2006
I've tested this module and it works! Basically the way it works is very simple. If you have a momentary switch that connects Ground and you use that as your trigger then you can fold and unfold the mirrors using that switch. The OEM switch panel cannot be use in our cars without some major surgery. However I have a idea that actually might be very neat and clean. Let me think about it some more before I give out the details.
There is another trigger that works on a +12V trigger - I've not got that working quite the way I thought it would be I think I need to play around with this some more. Currently I got it to work where it works only in one direction i.e. unfold.
There is another trigger that works on a +12V trigger - I've not got that working quite the way I thought it would be I think I need to play around with this some more. Currently I got it to work where it works only in one direction i.e. unfold.
04-18-2009, 01:18 AM
#43
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Originally Posted by bruce_miranda' post='850713' date='Apr 18 2009, 01:42 AM
I've tested this module and it works! Basically the way it works is very simple. If you have a momentary switch that connects Ground and you use that as your trigger then you can fold and unfold the mirrors using that switch. The OEM switch panel cannot be use in our cars without some major surgery. However I have a idea that actually might be very neat and clean. Let me think about it some more before I give out the details.
There is another trigger that works on a +12V trigger - I've not got that working quite the way I thought it would be I think I need to play around with this some more. Currently I got it to work where it works only in one direction i.e. unfold.
Attachment 77109
There is another trigger that works on a +12V trigger - I've not got that working quite the way I thought it would be I think I need to play around with this some more. Currently I got it to work where it works only in one direction i.e. unfold.
Attachment 77109
Well done! I was thinking see earlier post (+ve trigger) to alarm off. -ve trigger to alarm on signal. I was hoping the 'cycling' function you describe of -ve trigger is supressed with ignition off signal to the unit?
I.e. the push button fold/unfold would not work without the ignition on, could you report further please on that? So my proposal was to have the neg trigger connected to both alarm on signal AND hacking into the oem button for manual operation of folding within the car as well?
There is a possibilty with this config of manually folding the doors mirrors inside the car. Getting out locking it and the mirrors unfolding, it really depends how the unit works.
PS Great effort to post at 01:40 odd!!
04-18-2009, 02:26 AM
#44
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Model Year: 2006
The ignition trigger is only apparently used for the +ve trigger. The -ve trigger works with or without the ignition wire connected.
Quoted from another forum
1/ The SAM's Light Blue wire :
This wire must be connected to Ignition switched source only if you are planning to use the positive trigger wire (Brown/Red), if not it is useless to connect it.
2/ The SAM's Brown/Black wire :
As Paraklas did, this must be connected to pin 6 of the Euro switch and is activated by a single short press of the fold button on Euro Switch. First press will fold mirrors if unfolded and unfold if folded. The SAM has an internal memory that stores the last mirrors position, so no unwanted attempts to fol when already folded or to unfold when already unfolded (German State of Mind ).
This negative trigger wire is ALWAYS enabled, ignition ON or OFF, Light Blue wire connected or not. If you are parking your car in a very tight place, you'd like to be able to fold them while car is running .... Once more ... German Logic ...
3/ The Brown/Red wire :
This wire is intended to be connected to the WHITE wire (Lock 12v signal) of the 54pin connector of the General Module, not to the BLUE wire (Unlock 12v signal). So no Relay or Zeiner Diodes needed here, they will be useless. If you leave the car and lock it (with remote or key in keyhole), if the mirrors are folded they will stay folded, if they are unfolded they will fold upon locking. When you unlock your car, mirrors WILL NOT UNFOLD (German Logic, u don't want to unfold your mirrors on a car that has come and parked very close to yours).
The tricky part here is, if you get in your car, unfold mirrors manually, turn on engine and drive away in less than 60sec, there will be a risk of your mirrors folding when you doors autolock at 20kmh. So be careful with that if you have the Autolock doors at 20kmh activated.
Quoted from another forum
1/ The SAM's Light Blue wire :
This wire must be connected to Ignition switched source only if you are planning to use the positive trigger wire (Brown/Red), if not it is useless to connect it.
2/ The SAM's Brown/Black wire :
As Paraklas did, this must be connected to pin 6 of the Euro switch and is activated by a single short press of the fold button on Euro Switch. First press will fold mirrors if unfolded and unfold if folded. The SAM has an internal memory that stores the last mirrors position, so no unwanted attempts to fol when already folded or to unfold when already unfolded (German State of Mind ).
This negative trigger wire is ALWAYS enabled, ignition ON or OFF, Light Blue wire connected or not. If you are parking your car in a very tight place, you'd like to be able to fold them while car is running .... Once more ... German Logic ...
3/ The Brown/Red wire :
This wire is intended to be connected to the WHITE wire (Lock 12v signal) of the 54pin connector of the General Module, not to the BLUE wire (Unlock 12v signal). So no Relay or Zeiner Diodes needed here, they will be useless. If you leave the car and lock it (with remote or key in keyhole), if the mirrors are folded they will stay folded, if they are unfolded they will fold upon locking. When you unlock your car, mirrors WILL NOT UNFOLD (German Logic, u don't want to unfold your mirrors on a car that has come and parked very close to yours).
The tricky part here is, if you get in your car, unfold mirrors manually, turn on engine and drive away in less than 60sec, there will be a risk of your mirrors folding when you doors autolock at 20kmh. So be careful with that if you have the Autolock doors at 20kmh activated.
04-19-2009, 08:50 AM
#45
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Originally Posted by bruce_miranda' post='851047' date='Apr 18 2009, 11:26 AM
The ignition trigger is only apparently used for the +ve trigger. The -ve trigger works with or without the ignition wire connected.
Quoted from another forum
1/ The SAM's Light Blue wire :
This wire must be connected to Ignition switched source only if you are planning to use the positive trigger wire (Brown/Red), if not it is useless to connect it.
2/ The SAM's Brown/Black wire :
As Paraklas did, this must be connected to pin 6 of the Euro switch and is activated by a single short press of the fold button on Euro Switch. First press will fold mirrors if unfolded and unfold if folded. The SAM has an internal memory that stores the last mirrors position, so no unwanted attempts to fol when already folded or to unfold when already unfolded (German State of Mind ).
This negative trigger wire is ALWAYS enabled, ignition ON or OFF, Light Blue wire connected or not. If you are parking your car in a very tight place, you'd like to be able to fold them while car is running .... Once more ... German Logic ...
3/ The Brown/Red wire :
This wire is intended to be connected to the WHITE wire (Lock 12v signal) of the 54pin connector of the General Module, not to the BLUE wire (Unlock 12v signal). So no Relay or Zeiner Diodes needed here, they will be useless. If you leave the car and lock it (with remote or key in keyhole), if the mirrors are folded they will stay folded, if they are unfolded they will fold upon locking. When you unlock your car, mirrors WILL NOT UNFOLD (German Logic, u don't want to unfold your mirrors on a car that has come and parked very close to yours).
The tricky part here is, if you get in your car, unfold mirrors manually, turn on engine and drive away in less than 60sec, there will be a risk of your mirrors folding when you doors autolock at 20kmh. So be careful with that if you have the Autolock doors at 20kmh activated.
Quoted from another forum
1/ The SAM's Light Blue wire :
This wire must be connected to Ignition switched source only if you are planning to use the positive trigger wire (Brown/Red), if not it is useless to connect it.
2/ The SAM's Brown/Black wire :
As Paraklas did, this must be connected to pin 6 of the Euro switch and is activated by a single short press of the fold button on Euro Switch. First press will fold mirrors if unfolded and unfold if folded. The SAM has an internal memory that stores the last mirrors position, so no unwanted attempts to fol when already folded or to unfold when already unfolded (German State of Mind ).
This negative trigger wire is ALWAYS enabled, ignition ON or OFF, Light Blue wire connected or not. If you are parking your car in a very tight place, you'd like to be able to fold them while car is running .... Once more ... German Logic ...
3/ The Brown/Red wire :
This wire is intended to be connected to the WHITE wire (Lock 12v signal) of the 54pin connector of the General Module, not to the BLUE wire (Unlock 12v signal). So no Relay or Zeiner Diodes needed here, they will be useless. If you leave the car and lock it (with remote or key in keyhole), if the mirrors are folded they will stay folded, if they are unfolded they will fold upon locking. When you unlock your car, mirrors WILL NOT UNFOLD (German Logic, u don't want to unfold your mirrors on a car that has come and parked very close to yours).
The tricky part here is, if you get in your car, unfold mirrors manually, turn on engine and drive away in less than 60sec, there will be a risk of your mirrors folding when you doors autolock at 20kmh. So be careful with that if you have the Autolock doors at 20kmh activated.
So in degrees of complexity:
Config A - Remote only activation
1) Light Blue to +IGN or Pos 1 - Easy!
2) Brown/Black (-ve Trigger - always active, always reverses mirror state) to an UNLOCKING signal. Ok this has to be a pulse signal only not a grounding, so a relay powered by a central unlocking motor that closes a circuit to ground during unlocking is required. Easyish by using a standard auto relay.
3) Brown/Red (+ve Trigger, Active with ignition off, and then for 60 secs after ign on only, folds mirror if unfolded, does not reverse a folded mirror however) to LOCKING signal. Easy!
Config B - Remote + internal push button activation
1) Light Blue to +IGN or Pos 1 - Easy!
2) Brown/Black (-ve Trigger - always active, always reverses mirror position) to an UNLOCKING signal. Ok this has to be a pulse signal only not a grounding, so a relay powered by a central unlocking motor that closes a circuit to ground during unlocking is required. Easyish by using a standard auto relay. Next bit configure OEM internal button to momentarily close a circuit to ground by pushing (might take some physical work). Or use aftermarket (Easy). Connect this push to ground wire to relay output usee for SAM trigger above in config 1 (grounded when unlocking only), and then these wires join into SAM module as combined -ve trigger. Easy.
3) Brown/Red (+ve Trigger, Active with ignition off, and then for 60 secs after ign on only, folds mirror if unfolded, does not reverse a folded mirror however) to LOCKING signal. Easy!
The autolock within 60 secs or manual (internal switch) lock, or either unlock signal at any time would however still activate these mirrors in config A or B
So Config C)
In the grounding to earth output from the relay used in 2) (above) during unlocking add in line to the grounding output another relay that is NC (normally closed) output when unpowered, but power this by connecting to ign on lead (i.e. join to wire used in 1). Therefore this circuit would never be grounded by unlocking with the ignition on, as in effect you need 2 switches in series closed to ground, however make sure the button grounding is connected in parallel to the locking output so it triggers at all times.
A similar trick for the 3) wire positive trigger, again a normally closed relay in series in the signal wire going to the sam, that opens the circuit at ignition on thus neutering it all the time the ignition is ever on...
Wow that may not be right, i am going on Bruce's input via another forum.. But i think it would do the trick.
It may sound complex to read, but actually its 3 trivial and inexpensive relays, probably adds 30 mins to fitting time and ?10.. It really needs a diagram for ease of interpreting, and a trial. Bruce can you help?
So in summary config C) gives you:
Auto fold (if not previously folded from internally) on central locking from fob or key.
Auto unfold from fob or key.
Fold/unfold from internal button at all times.
NO folding/unfolding from autolock if that is indeed selected from Idrive.
No folding/unfolding from car central lock button when IGN is on. Mirrors WILL fold/unfold with ignition off from car internal central lock button.
I have no idea what the factory spec is, however this is what i am after, you modify accordingly.
Now then Bruce.....
02-12-2010, 10:50 AM
#46
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I know its taken me some time looking at my last post date, but i have done it.
Almost as i had described above, involving much much time and iterations of wiring until i got it absolutely right.
But i now have folding mirrors on my car that work both with the remote to lock/unlock and from the manual push button inside the car. And i can still have autolock enabled and/or manually lock unlock with the ignition on using the button by the hazards, all of which will not move my mirrors. The manual fold/unfold will ALWAYS work however.
And yes this is the OEM button, so does look identical to a factory car. No software programming. 1 Innoparts controller, 3 relays (see above) and one timer to solve a minor issue.
Bruce is right this was a real effort to get the OEM look, i did cock up the first window switch i bought off him and had to scrap it. I did have the drivers door card off about 10 times in total, due to mainly unexpected behaviour, not just incompetence!!
However if anybody is interested, i could do a step through guide, which WILL work first time. It took me physically on and off 2 weeks to fit, i would think i or anybody could do another in 4-6hrs or a very easy day.
I am as happy as a pig in manure!
Almost as i had described above, involving much much time and iterations of wiring until i got it absolutely right.
But i now have folding mirrors on my car that work both with the remote to lock/unlock and from the manual push button inside the car. And i can still have autolock enabled and/or manually lock unlock with the ignition on using the button by the hazards, all of which will not move my mirrors. The manual fold/unfold will ALWAYS work however.
And yes this is the OEM button, so does look identical to a factory car. No software programming. 1 Innoparts controller, 3 relays (see above) and one timer to solve a minor issue.
Bruce is right this was a real effort to get the OEM look, i did cock up the first window switch i bought off him and had to scrap it. I did have the drivers door card off about 10 times in total, due to mainly unexpected behaviour, not just incompetence!!
However if anybody is interested, i could do a step through guide, which WILL work first time. It took me physically on and off 2 weeks to fit, i would think i or anybody could do another in 4-6hrs or a very easy day.
I am as happy as a pig in manure!
02-12-2010, 02:40 PM
#47
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Model Year: 2006
I am all year. Go on, what did you do.
02-14-2010, 12:18 AM
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Hi im away for a few days, but a quick preview is as follows. 2 tricky parts to this.
1) Understanding the wiring on an E60 is not easy. This has been covered before but not in great detail. Getting a 12V battery supply and a 12v ignition switched on/off with key directly was very time consuming and non trivial. The majority of the car turns on on wake and turns off on sleep. It is a difficult beast to hardwire stuff into as your never quite sure what that wire is going to do in the next 15 mins! This is obviously not mirror specific.
2) The door mirror switch choice is critical. I tried 10 of different ones, the best one was this subminiature switch.
Youve got to open up your bmw switch fish out the pcb and drill right through it to accept your new switch. Soldering onto this pcb is a specialist job it would require very small hands!
The diameter of the hole was critical. First switch i cocked up as i drilled too large a hole. This then spliced into other pcb tracks shorting them out.
Youve got about 5mm diameter hole you can get away with and it had better be central at that! I actually drilled about 4mm on the second window switch pcb and filed it out to fit as you can control what you are doing better like that.
http://www.maplin.co.uk/module.aspx?...C=SO&U=Strat15
Basically a bit of filing down the actual switch plastic push bit until it is the right length and drilled a big hole out of the back of the housing to allow the 2 wires to be soldered to the new switch within the bmw window switch.
I have just found the original photo of the one that never worked.
1) Understanding the wiring on an E60 is not easy. This has been covered before but not in great detail. Getting a 12V battery supply and a 12v ignition switched on/off with key directly was very time consuming and non trivial. The majority of the car turns on on wake and turns off on sleep. It is a difficult beast to hardwire stuff into as your never quite sure what that wire is going to do in the next 15 mins! This is obviously not mirror specific.
2) The door mirror switch choice is critical. I tried 10 of different ones, the best one was this subminiature switch.
Youve got to open up your bmw switch fish out the pcb and drill right through it to accept your new switch. Soldering onto this pcb is a specialist job it would require very small hands!
The diameter of the hole was critical. First switch i cocked up as i drilled too large a hole. This then spliced into other pcb tracks shorting them out.
Youve got about 5mm diameter hole you can get away with and it had better be central at that! I actually drilled about 4mm on the second window switch pcb and filed it out to fit as you can control what you are doing better like that.
http://www.maplin.co.uk/module.aspx?...C=SO&U=Strat15
Basically a bit of filing down the actual switch plastic push bit until it is the right length and drilled a big hole out of the back of the housing to allow the 2 wires to be soldered to the new switch within the bmw window switch.
I have just found the original photo of the one that never worked.
02-14-2010, 09:19 AM
#50
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Model Year: 2006
I'm actually taking another route to get the OEM buttom to work the mirrors, I'm looking to pick up the button press off the CAN bus. I've just put the mirrors on and got the puddle lights working and brought the Fold motor wires out into the door panel.
I would like to know how you routed the wires from the car into the door - it seems quite involved and it looks like I have to rip that foam lining on the door to get to the wiring harness.
I would like to know how you routed the wires from the car into the door - it seems quite involved and it looks like I have to rip that foam lining on the door to get to the wiring harness.