swajames

They were accused once - it was the same issue. New evidence came to light, and it was Ron Dennis himself who informed the FIA of its existence once he became aware of it.

madoon

noooooo... my dear friend, you should read again... first time they were acused they were found guitly but nothing could prove they used the data, soon after the "new evidence" was found (alonso gave Berine Ecclestone, who informed the FIA) a new trial was setup, and they were disqualified, they were happy to only be disqualified as they were really close to a 1 year ban...
so it was same issue, and found guitly twice

swajames

Right back at you - it was Ron Dennis himself that delivered the news of the evidence to the FIA, he informed Max Mosely after Alonso has allegedly tried to use it to lever preferential treatment over Hamilton. Bernie Ecclestone had nothing to do with it. McLaren had one hearing and one appeal - in relation to he same event. They wern't accused of two separate issues, which is what I thought your initial post implied.

madoon

i tried to look for the articles, but couldnt find them, and you probably wont care... so ill leave it where it is..

madoon

just confirmed.. KIMI world champion..
http://en.f1-live.com/f1/en/headlines/news...022021834.shtml

swajames

No, if you find them I'd certainly be interested in seeing them. We'll probably never truly get to the bottom of the events within McLaren this season (and I doubt anyone knows everything that went on), but here's a BBC article that discussus the sequence of events that led to the appeal. As I said, I believe that they are a decent, honest team that got undermined by two employees - one a key engineer, and one a former world champion whom I hope never sets foot in a McLaren again...

http://news.bbc.co.uk/sport1/hi/moto...ne/7003042.stm

JetBlack5OC

Could you imagine if it was Alonso's car that stalled on the track instead of Hamilton?s? There would be a huge controversy.

Anyways, I'm glad neither McLaren driver won, little-puck Hamilton and blackmailing-fag Alonso.

Congrats to Kimi, I swear until today he had the worst luck out of any driver on the planet. He was my favorite driver until he went to Ferrari. Oh well I still have Finnish blood in me, glad he won.

AlexFW

Don't waste your time dear madoon : he is english, he is always onest like Mc Laren
And he can't accept the defeat like McLaren is doing in these hours, while all people celebrate the new champion

BetterMakeWay

Congrats to Kimi and Ferrari! They deserve it and really took advantage over the issue at Mclaren. Period. Although someone should tell that lil' robot that he won not only the race but the chapionsip.

Having said that we can discuss a little bit more about the race. Iceman there are no rules in F1 are there? Really now, no sane person can belive that Massa simply was overtaken by Mimi on fair performance. It was clear Massa let him won the race and the championship. Some may say it is obvious it should be that way but i say the story was sowed with red strings. When some bloke in Mclaren (or any other theam) attacks hsi teammate with the team agreement is called team order. When Ferrari does it FIA closes it's eyes. But let's jsut say it's normal for a faster driver to let hid teamdriver win the championship as a help gift.

About Ron Deniss i can't say more: What an idiot!!! If you ask me he should have let both drivers have equal chances at the championship and let the ego and all the hate aside. If you ask me it was clear Alonso didn't have equal chances with hamilton as i saw how Alonso lost in the first 5 laps around 20-30 seconds to the Ferrari (when in the whole championsip the cars were close if not better than Ferrari) and also Hamilton drew way closer lap times than Alonso did (not talent and skill at those times). Anyway it doesn't matter, i'm happy that Hamilton punk didn't win an Ferrari did. Out of the two for me it was better Ferrari to win. Hamilton was so arogant that 2-3 races ago he saw himself champion. Well guess what fortune favors the brave and he got what he deserved.

I feel a bit pity for Alonso as he started the season as a top driver at Mclaren and after Ron&Hmailton got more intimate he started to feel neglected and not only that the team (Hamilton also) didn't show him the rightfull merits for developing the car and bringing up to the level it performed this season, considering in 2006 Mclaren ran squat. IMO Ron hold the biggest balem for this, and whatever people say i still think that he knew right from the start about the Ferrari documents. He should have let Alonso have his fair chance in the last race as it would still be Mclaren world champion not Ferrari.

We'll see how next yar Mclaren does. I think Alonso will leave the team, it's the most plausible fact. At least that's what i would doif i were Alonso. Having said that rumors say Nico Rosberg will jump in the team as Hmailton remains no 1 driver. If that's so i really think they will have some problems deeloping the ca for 2008 since neither of them has the experience and skill imo to deliver such a car. At elast not the skill Alonso has when he developed the car for 2007.
Interesting to see where Alonso will go, probably Renault?! Rumors also said Toyota offered a check in whte for him but Alonso didn't wqant to go that deep to start digging.

BMW aims for championship title for 2008 and i expect from them such a good performance if they keep up the pace. And if they deliver such performance it won't be too dreamy to think about the driver's title also.

In the end , i say again congrats to Ferrari and Kiwi. They deserved it cuz simply they had more brains.

AlexFW

Wait, wait: Massa didn't slow down on the track and let Kimi pass .. This, formally, would be an order by the team .
So close your mouth