znod

Also, the comfort seats are pretty heavy incremetally over sport seats. I have read about 40 lbs total for each seat. Do you think that value is correct? Are the seats --10# above--for each sport seat?

UUronL

I agree. I'd really like to know what the various options weigh.
[/quote]


No, actually difference stays about the same if you're comparing 330i sport to 530i sport. BMW USA actually says how much the sport package of the 330i weighs (33lbs) making the total unladen weight 3450lbs. (manual 2006 530i of unspecified optioning is listed as 3472lbs) Car and Driver also isn't very consistent with its reporting of weight. Take the most recent 330i test - they didn't bother to weigh it since they drove it in EU and then reported and took pictures of a completely different car (the US spec). They simply grabbed the weight listed on BMWNA's site and marked it as "curb weight" even though it is the unladen weight (3450lbs).

Car and Driver also has not tested an N52 engined 530i yet (engine alone is lighter by 22lbs), and the last 5 tested of any kind was an automatic, adding quite a bit of weight. The 2004 530i sport had AS. (adding weight) There is no trickery - the radically low weight of the 5-series is due to expensive aluminum front-end construction and other weight saving measures.


BTW - premium gasoline weighs approx. 6.35lbs/gal. So 18.5gal x 6.35 = ~117.5lbs. I can't possibly enumerate all the other fluids, but rest assured there is substantially more to be added. For the most part, both series of cars will have the same figures for all but the gasoline which isn't much of a difference.

There's no conspiracy, no half-truths. The only confusion is understanding unladen weight. I'd expect the actual curb weight of the 3 to be very close.

UUronL

Sure the rims and tires -might- weigh that much, but what's the delta between the new rims and the old rims? Not nearly so much. Let's not confuse things by adding weight and not subtracting the tires and wheels we're removing. No AS anymore in the sport package.

300TTto545

Sure the rims and tires -might- weigh that much, but what's the delta between the new rims and the old rims? Not nearly so much. Let's not confuse things by adding weight and not subtracting the tires and wheels we're removing. No AS anymore in the sport package.
[/quote]

I was talking deltas. NRFT weigh (at least PS2s) 24# less than RFT.
18" sport rims weigh 32 + 34 = total of 130#. It is not inconceivable that "regular" 17 inch rims might be 26 all around for a total of 104# for a savings of 26#. The toal savings would be 50# (It is just as conceivable that stock 17s are 24 # making the total delta 58#).

UUronL

Sure the rims and tires -might- weigh that much, but what's the delta between the new rims and the old rims? Not nearly so much. Let's not confuse things by adding weight and not subtracting the tires and wheels we're removing. No AS anymore in the sport package.
[/quote]

I was talking deltas. NRFT weigh (at least PS2s) 24# less than RFT.
18" sport rims weigh 32 + 34 = total of 130#. It is not inconceivable that "regular" 17 inch rims might be 26 all around for a total of 104# for a savings of 26#. The toal savings would be 50# (It is just as conceivable that stock 17s are 24 # making the total delta 58#).
[/quote]

I simply refuse to ignore the fact that this is all conjecture based upon tire data that isn't even part of the OEM equipment list... Data on Michelin tires might be beneficial to owners who have installed them, but for the discussion of cars and their weights as equipped from the factory this data provides no benefit.

The only data I've been able to find with regard to Dunlop RFTs (what I have) is on smaller 17" Dunlop runflats - the claim being that they weigh just 21lbs a tire. This is identical or -lighter- than other non-RFT 17" of the same size. Dunlop replaces the steel belts in its runflats with aramid fiber, which should be lighter while being pound for pound stronger than steel. It's entirely possible that very little weight is gained from the tires. Do you happen to have specifics on the Michelin RFT construction that might shed some light? I guess I'll simply hold out until more data is gathered. Also, how do you rectify your guesstimates against BMW NA's statement that the entire 3 series sport package adds just 33lbs more than the stock car?

I don't share your low estimates for the 17" wheel weight.


EDIT - Tirerack has weight information for the 18" Dunlops on my car (245/40 WR18 93W) - 29 lbs per tire. What is the OEM 17" 225/50 17 that comes on the 2006 530i? Tire Rack seems to think it's a Bridgestone Potenza RE050 RFT (225/50 WR17 94W). Is this correct? If so, the non-sport tire is 31 lbs per tire - actually 2 lbs per tire heavier than the 18" sport tire.

300TTto545

Sure the rims and tires -might- weigh that much, but what's the delta between the new rims and the old rims? Not nearly so much. Let's not confuse things by adding weight and not subtracting the tires and wheels we're removing. No AS anymore in the sport package.
[/quote]

I was talking deltas. NRFT weigh (at least PS2s) 24# less than RFT.
18" sport rims weigh 32 + 34 = total of 130#. It is not inconceivable that "regular" 17 inch rims might be 26 all around for a total of 104# for a savings of 26#. The toal savings would be 50# (It is just as conceivable that stock 17s are 24 # making the total delta 58#).
[/quote]

I simply refuse to ignore the fact that this is all conjecture based upon tire data that isn't even part of the OEM equipment list... Data on Michelin tires might be beneficial to owners who have installed them, but for the discussion of cars and their weights as equipped from the factory this data provides no benefit.

The only data I've been able to find with regard to Dunlop RFTs (what I have) is on smaller 17" Dunlop runflats - the claim being that they weigh just 21lbs a tire. This is identical or -lighter- than other non-RFT 17" of the same size. Dunlop replaces the steel belts in its runflats with aramid fiber, which should be lighter while being pound for pound stronger than steel. It's entirely possible that very little weight is gained from the tires. Do you happen to have specifics on the Michelin RFT construction that might shed some light? I guess I'll simply hold out until more data is gathered. Also, how do you rectify your guesstimates against BMW NA's statement that the entire 3 series sport package adds just 33lbs more than the stock car?

I don't share your low estimates for the 17" wheel weight.


EDIT - Tirerack has weight information for the 18" Dunlops on my car (245/40 WR18 93W) - 29 lbs per tire. What is the OEM 17" 225/50 17 that comes on the 2006 530i? Tire Rack seems to think it's a Bridgestone Potenza RE050 RFT (225/50 WR17 94W). Is this correct? If so, the non-sport tire is 31 lbs per tire - actually 2 lbs per tire heavier than the 18" sport tire.
[/quote]

For 5 series RFT=sport package NRFT = non sport

For 3 series - All have RFT - that would help explain the weight difference (or lack thereof for the sport pack). The other 3 series issue is that they do not increase the width of the rim with the sport pack but the 5 series does.

The Michelin PS2 weights were the only data I have. I would think that normal NRFT (performance) would weigh similar to each other. That is why the estimate.

I am no tire expert but I have heard from multiple sources that RFT weigh more that NRFT. Non sport have all-season, non runflat tires so Tirerack is wrong about the standard tires for the 5 series (just checked on BMWUSA).

UUronL

Sure the rims and tires -might- weigh that much, but what's the delta between the new rims and the old rims? Not nearly so much. Let's not confuse things by adding weight and not subtracting the tires and wheels we're removing. No AS anymore in the sport package.
[/quote]

I was talking deltas. NRFT weigh (at least PS2s) 24# less than RFT.
18" sport rims weigh 32 + 34 = total of 130#. It is not inconceivable that "regular" 17 inch rims might be 26 all around for a total of 104# for a savings of 26#. The toal savings would be 50# (It is just as conceivable that stock 17s are 24 # making the total delta 58#).
[/quote]

I simply refuse to ignore the fact that this is all conjecture based upon tire data that isn't even part of the OEM equipment list... Data on Michelin tires might be beneficial to owners who have installed them, but for the discussion of cars and their weights as equipped from the factory this data provides no benefit.

The only data I've been able to find with regard to Dunlop RFTs (what I have) is on smaller 17" Dunlop runflats - the claim being that they weigh just 21lbs a tire. This is identical or -lighter- than other non-RFT 17" of the same size. Dunlop replaces the steel belts in its runflats with aramid fiber, which should be lighter while being pound for pound stronger than steel. It's entirely possible that very little weight is gained from the tires. Do you happen to have specifics on the Michelin RFT construction that might shed some light? I guess I'll simply hold out until more data is gathered. Also, how do you rectify your guesstimates against BMW NA's statement that the entire 3 series sport package adds just 33lbs more than the stock car?

I don't share your low estimates for the 17" wheel weight.


EDIT - Tirerack has weight information for the 18" Dunlops on my car (245/40 WR18 93W) - 29 lbs per tire. What is the OEM 17" 225/50 17 that comes on the 2006 530i? Tire Rack seems to think it's a Bridgestone Potenza RE050 RFT (225/50 WR17 94W). Is this correct? If so, the non-sport tire is 31 lbs per tire - actually 2 lbs per tire heavier than the 18" sport tire.
[/quote]

For 5 series RFT=sport package NRFT = non sport

For 3 series - All have RFT - that would help explain the weight difference (or lack thereof for the sport pack). The other 3 series issue is that they do not increase the width of the rim with the sport pack but the 5 series does.

The Michelin PS2 weights were the only data I have. I would think that normal NRFT (performance) would weigh similar to each other. That is why the estimate.

I am no tire expert but I have heard from multiple sources that RFT weigh more that NRFT. Non sport have all-season, non runflat tires so Tirerack is wrong about the standard tires for the 5 series (just checked on BMWUSA).
[/quote]

So what are the model and brand of tire for the standard 5 Series? Also do you know that RFTs weren't added for the 5 for Sept. 05? The mark is 29 lbs (Dunlop 18"). Lighter or heavier....?