bmw quality...
04-03-2006, 07:09 AM
#51
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Originally Posted by Simple1' post='263534' date='Apr 2 2006, 03:29 AM
all this talk scares me now as I'm getting ready to order my car in the next coming summer months.
Aside from some minor issues with software on earlier e60's, which are pretty much fixed with the latest models, most people don't have problems.
If your not fussed about having them avoiding dynamic drive and active steering are also good ways to make sure you don't end up with trouble.
Other than that reliability is good and it's a great car to own.
Human nature means that we are often more likely to post a rant about problems than post a 'i'm happy with my car' thread.
04-04-2006, 11:43 AM
#52
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My Ride: 530d Sport A - Dec 04. Titanium Silver. Nav Pro
Originally Posted by needforspeed' post='264014' date='Apr 3 2006, 04:09 PM
Although this forum has loads of useful info, my first impression was that there were a LOT of unhappy e60 owners posting problems. I don't think that's really the case though.
Aside from some minor issues with software on earlier e60's, which are pretty much fixed with the latest models, most people don't have problems.
If your not fussed about having them avoiding dynamic drive and active steering are also good ways to make sure you don't end up with trouble.
Other than that reliability is good and it's a great car to own.
Human nature means that we are often more likely to post a rant about problems than post a 'i'm happy with my car' thread.
Aside from some minor issues with software on earlier e60's, which are pretty much fixed with the latest models, most people don't have problems.
If your not fussed about having them avoiding dynamic drive and active steering are also good ways to make sure you don't end up with trouble.
Other than that reliability is good and it's a great car to own.
Human nature means that we are often more likely to post a rant about problems than post a 'i'm happy with my car' thread.
Here my 2.7 cents worth:
I read this (and others like this) thread with a bemusement! The fact that some of the members have a "problems" with their E60 is not indicative of the ALL E60's build have a problems, mine does not!
I do not know how many members are here on the forum, but I'm sure that only a fraction of them has some "quality" issues. The fact that BMW, and most other manufactures, offer 2 - 3 year warranty simply acknowledges that may there be a problems down the line, and if so they will fix it. Another point worth mentioning is; if they are all bad, how come they sell a lot of them!
As for all the "unbreakable" super brands, please go to Acura, Infinity, Audi, MB and the so often mentioned Lexus forums and read!! You will be surprised how many problems they have!
My point, I guess, is that all things, however well build, can go and a percentage of them will go wrong!
Enjoy your E60! And if one stop enjoying it, one should move on and buy xxxxx....xxxx.
Wlodek
04-04-2006, 11:51 AM
#53
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[b]'Finally, I think most of you folks expect too much really - you expect a $60K car to be perfect and never break donw? WHY? Because YOU paid $60K for it? So what? There are way more expensive cars that break down more often, and cost more to repair, don't even get me started on Ferraris and Lamborghinis! You think Lexus or Acura (insert your favorite brand here) will be better? Sell your BMW and get an Acura. But stop complaining about how bad BMW are, I really sick of listening to this! They are not perfect, no car is, no matter how much you pay, $60K or $600K.'[/b]
60k? I paid 72k after taxes for the 550 even after a generous discount. Yes I expect alot for that kind of money. I work hard for my money and want every penny to get me what I want. Like I said I love BMW for the drive but why for the price we pay cant we have both reliability and an awesome drive?
"why should we have to be careful using these cars if they cost more then Lexus but Lexus products can go 10 years without problems?" - are you for real?
"If I had to buy a car I would buy Lexus, thank god I only lease these BMWs" - why don't you lease a Lexus then? You won't have anything to complain about [/b]
Yes I am for real about selling my 6-9 year old Lexus cars to my relatives and they are still in mint condition with only oil changes being done to them. And if you are sick about hearing complaints about BMWs then dont read the threads. The concept of having a forum is to read everyones opinions regardless if you agree with them or not. There is no reason to get hostile. I have a 997 911 CS that is a great with no problems so I am not bagging on German engineering, in fact I have owned as many german made cars as japanese cars. I just want more reliability so I can feel secure about owning one after forking out the money.
60k? I paid 72k after taxes for the 550 even after a generous discount. Yes I expect alot for that kind of money. I work hard for my money and want every penny to get me what I want. Like I said I love BMW for the drive but why for the price we pay cant we have both reliability and an awesome drive?
"why should we have to be careful using these cars if they cost more then Lexus but Lexus products can go 10 years without problems?" - are you for real?
"If I had to buy a car I would buy Lexus, thank god I only lease these BMWs" - why don't you lease a Lexus then? You won't have anything to complain about [/b]
Yes I am for real about selling my 6-9 year old Lexus cars to my relatives and they are still in mint condition with only oil changes being done to them. And if you are sick about hearing complaints about BMWs then dont read the threads. The concept of having a forum is to read everyones opinions regardless if you agree with them or not. There is no reason to get hostile. I have a 997 911 CS that is a great with no problems so I am not bagging on German engineering, in fact I have owned as many german made cars as japanese cars. I just want more reliability so I can feel secure about owning one after forking out the money.
04-04-2006, 05:51 PM
#54
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I really didnt pay attention what you have wrote before but now I do.
Originally Posted by TexaZ3' post='263004' date='Mar 31 2006, 11:16 AM
Ok, I felt really strongly after reading this post, so excuse my harshness when you read the following...
First of all, I'm sorry you are having so many problems with your car. Maybe you'll be better of driving a Lexus afterall. Now, I would like to address several other points of the original post and other's replies.
Most of the problems, like window motors, check engine lights, etc are common with all manufacturers, even Lexus, etc (believe me, I owned 3 Lexuses) and that is given no car has sophistication of a BMW. They are pioneers of a car industry, and yes, their stuff breaks, but that's how they pave way for japanese copycats like Lexus. Have you ever heard of any significant technologocal advancement in automotive design, technology, or materials made by Lexus recently? No? Hmmmm.....
You should take youre self to any japanese car dealer on the weekend rather than looking at your z3 and 530. They do make quality stuff. Acura RL? M45? They all have kick ass interior. Japanese maybe a copycats so what? there are nothing wrong with it.
Car produces bigger noise when A/C is turned on - REALLY? Maybe that is because generator gets additional load from running A/C compressor? I know the difference if it is normal or not when a/c being turned on
Brake noise due to sensor - well, change the freaking sensor - its a warranty repair. Most cars don't even have brake sensors (well, maybe most do now, but anyway), why is this a big deal? It is a big deal because after warrenty, money have to comes out of my pocket
Now, paint peeling is something that might be triggered by the climate, or your skin oils - do you wash your hands often? Do you use skin conditioners? And...cut your fingernails! Never had this problem with any of my BMWs, including my '03 build E60. I bet I wash hands more than you do, and cut my fingernail? you must be joking. I never had any of peeling issue with any other brands car I bought previously with same length finger nail. WTF are you talking about?
Finally, I think most of you folks expect too much really - you expect a $60K car to be perfect and never break donw? WHY? Because YOU paid $60K for it? So what? There are way more expensive cars that break down more often, and cost more to repair, don't even get me started on Ferraris and Lamborghinis! You think Lexus or Acura (insert your favorite brand here) will be better? Sell your BMW and get an Acura. But stop complaining about how bad BMW are, I really sick of listening to this! They are not perfect, no car is, no matter how much you pay, $60K or $600K. Why should I stop complaining? let me guess oh, b/c you are a huge bmw fan dont wanna hear about anything bad about bmw?
"why should we have to be careful using these cars if they cost more then Lexus but Lexus products can go 10 years without problems?" - are you for real? Yes, FOR REAL
"If I had to buy a car I would buy Lexus, thank god I only lease these BMWs" - why don't you lease a Lexus then? You won't have anything to complain about then? dont worry, people do lease a lexus
I bought all my BMWs for what they are = a driving machine, not a comfortable couch on wheels like MB, and not an old lady car like Lexus. No car will match BMW value for the price - and you decide what you drive. I apologize if I came through abrasive, but that thread is ridiculous! No car will match value for the price? With same money you can get any Jap cars loaded with features and less trouble.
First of all, I'm sorry you are having so many problems with your car. Maybe you'll be better of driving a Lexus afterall. Now, I would like to address several other points of the original post and other's replies.
Most of the problems, like window motors, check engine lights, etc are common with all manufacturers, even Lexus, etc (believe me, I owned 3 Lexuses) and that is given no car has sophistication of a BMW. They are pioneers of a car industry, and yes, their stuff breaks, but that's how they pave way for japanese copycats like Lexus. Have you ever heard of any significant technologocal advancement in automotive design, technology, or materials made by Lexus recently? No? Hmmmm.....
You should take youre self to any japanese car dealer on the weekend rather than looking at your z3 and 530. They do make quality stuff. Acura RL? M45? They all have kick ass interior. Japanese maybe a copycats so what? there are nothing wrong with it.
Car produces bigger noise when A/C is turned on - REALLY? Maybe that is because generator gets additional load from running A/C compressor? I know the difference if it is normal or not when a/c being turned on
Brake noise due to sensor - well, change the freaking sensor - its a warranty repair. Most cars don't even have brake sensors (well, maybe most do now, but anyway), why is this a big deal? It is a big deal because after warrenty, money have to comes out of my pocket
Now, paint peeling is something that might be triggered by the climate, or your skin oils - do you wash your hands often? Do you use skin conditioners? And...cut your fingernails! Never had this problem with any of my BMWs, including my '03 build E60. I bet I wash hands more than you do, and cut my fingernail? you must be joking. I never had any of peeling issue with any other brands car I bought previously with same length finger nail. WTF are you talking about?
Finally, I think most of you folks expect too much really - you expect a $60K car to be perfect and never break donw? WHY? Because YOU paid $60K for it? So what? There are way more expensive cars that break down more often, and cost more to repair, don't even get me started on Ferraris and Lamborghinis! You think Lexus or Acura (insert your favorite brand here) will be better? Sell your BMW and get an Acura. But stop complaining about how bad BMW are, I really sick of listening to this! They are not perfect, no car is, no matter how much you pay, $60K or $600K. Why should I stop complaining? let me guess oh, b/c you are a huge bmw fan dont wanna hear about anything bad about bmw?
"why should we have to be careful using these cars if they cost more then Lexus but Lexus products can go 10 years without problems?" - are you for real? Yes, FOR REAL
"If I had to buy a car I would buy Lexus, thank god I only lease these BMWs" - why don't you lease a Lexus then? You won't have anything to complain about then? dont worry, people do lease a lexus
I bought all my BMWs for what they are = a driving machine, not a comfortable couch on wheels like MB, and not an old lady car like Lexus. No car will match BMW value for the price - and you decide what you drive. I apologize if I came through abrasive, but that thread is ridiculous! No car will match value for the price? With same money you can get any Jap cars loaded with features and less trouble.
04-07-2006, 12:49 PM
#55
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My Ride: 2004 BMW 545i, Olivin Green, w/Sports Package, basic stereo, chrome wheels, tinted windows, Bluetooth enabled with Moto V710 (Verizon), Sirius Sat Radio (aftermarket), Auxiliary Input for Ipod.
I can't speak for everyone else but here's my observations/comparison with my 2004 545 sports package vs my Lexus GS300
Cost:
Lexus: $40K
BMW: $60K
Miles driven:
L: 106K
B: 36K
Number of trips to service dept: (excluding scheduled maintenance)
L: 3 (in 7 years)
B: 12 (2.5 years)
Cost for Repairs:
L: $4000 ($3000 suspension related+90K tune up)
B: $0, (paid $1200 or so extra for 100K mile/6yr coverage)
Tires Replacement:
L: 2 times, $800 total
B: 1 time, $1400
Audio/stereo Quality: 1-10 scale
L: 9
B: 3
Ergonomics and interior quality:
L: 9
B: 5
Driving Pleasure: 1-10 scale
L: 7
B: 10
I love my BMW but...
Cost:
Lexus: $40K
BMW: $60K
Miles driven:
L: 106K
B: 36K
Number of trips to service dept: (excluding scheduled maintenance)
L: 3 (in 7 years)
B: 12 (2.5 years)
Cost for Repairs:
L: $4000 ($3000 suspension related+90K tune up)
B: $0, (paid $1200 or so extra for 100K mile/6yr coverage)
Tires Replacement:
L: 2 times, $800 total
B: 1 time, $1400
Audio/stereo Quality: 1-10 scale
L: 9
B: 3
Ergonomics and interior quality:
L: 9
B: 5
Driving Pleasure: 1-10 scale
L: 7
B: 10
I love my BMW but...
04-07-2006, 12:55 PM
#56
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Originally Posted by teriyaki88' post='266085' date='Apr 7 2006, 04:49 PM
I love my BMW but...
What year was your GS300? It's the old 3.0L Toyota engine also found in the older Camry, Sienna (minivan) and others. Was it the first year of production?
And I'm not sure what kind of shoes you're putting on your GS300 but even for our Minivan the tires cost about $1000 for a set of four. You paid $400?!
04-07-2006, 01:53 PM
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>>You should take youre self to any japanese car dealer on the weekend rather than looking at your z3 and 530. - I don't look at them - I drive them, instead of whining about a coating peeling from a button! My god! And I own 3 japanese cars currently, (and owned probably 10 more in the past) so no need to go to the dealership, I know exactly what they are.
>>They do make quality stuff. Acura RL? M45? - nobody said they make total crap. Japanese wouldn't be where they are now if they made junk, but then again, Kia is also selling well, and have 10 year warranty, but you won't buy Kia now would you?
>>They all have kick ass interior - Literally? What's so "kick-ass" about it?
>>Japanese maybe a copycats so what? there are nothing wrong with it. - No, there is nothing wrong with cheating ans stealing also.
>>I know the difference if it is normal or not when a/c being turned on - Good for you!
>>It is a big deal because after warrenty, money have to comes out of my pocket - Here is the new concept for ya - cars do break, and eventually you pay money to fix them. Get over it or you won't find peace in this life.
>>I bet I wash hands more than you do, and cut my fingernail? - Prove it? Can't - don't make an assumption then.
>>you must be joking. I never had any of peeling issue with any other brands car I bought previously with same length finger nail. WTF are you talking about? - No, I was serious, and no need to be sarcastic, I was just making a guess to help you find the problem, but I guess you don't need it
>>Why should I stop complaining? let me guess oh, b/c you are a huge bmw fan dont wanna hear about anything bad about bmw? - I could care less what you say about BMW, I just don't want to read through "made up" problem thread o nthe forum that used to be useful for BMW enthusiasts. And for what its worth, I'm not that big BMW fan either.
>>"why should we have to be careful using these cars if they cost more then Lexus but Lexus products can go 10 years without problems?" - are you for real? Yes, FOR REAL - that were not even your words!
>>With same money you can get any Jap cars loaded with features and less trouble. - I suggest you do this as soon as possible! Run Forest, run!
Good, I o nthe other hand think I will ignore everything you write from now on. 
>>They do make quality stuff. Acura RL? M45? - nobody said they make total crap. Japanese wouldn't be where they are now if they made junk, but then again, Kia is also selling well, and have 10 year warranty, but you won't buy Kia now would you?
>>They all have kick ass interior - Literally? What's so "kick-ass" about it?
>>Japanese maybe a copycats so what? there are nothing wrong with it. - No, there is nothing wrong with cheating ans stealing also.
>>I know the difference if it is normal or not when a/c being turned on - Good for you!
>>It is a big deal because after warrenty, money have to comes out of my pocket - Here is the new concept for ya - cars do break, and eventually you pay money to fix them. Get over it or you won't find peace in this life.
>>I bet I wash hands more than you do, and cut my fingernail? - Prove it? Can't - don't make an assumption then.
>>you must be joking. I never had any of peeling issue with any other brands car I bought previously with same length finger nail. WTF are you talking about? - No, I was serious, and no need to be sarcastic, I was just making a guess to help you find the problem, but I guess you don't need it
>>Why should I stop complaining? let me guess oh, b/c you are a huge bmw fan dont wanna hear about anything bad about bmw? - I could care less what you say about BMW, I just don't want to read through "made up" problem thread o nthe forum that used to be useful for BMW enthusiasts. And for what its worth, I'm not that big BMW fan either.
>>"why should we have to be careful using these cars if they cost more then Lexus but Lexus products can go 10 years without problems?" - are you for real? Yes, FOR REAL - that were not even your words!
>>With same money you can get any Jap cars loaded with features and less trouble. - I suggest you do this as soon as possible! Run Forest, run!
Originally Posted by aultimateE60' post='264754' date='Apr 4 2006, 08:51 PM
I really didnt pay attention what you have wrote before but now I do.
04-07-2006, 04:06 PM
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My Ride: Arrived 3 June 2005: 2005 545i - Orient Blue, Black interior, Sport, Steptronic, Cold Weather, NAV, Sirius, Logic7, Comfort Seats, Sunshades. What a glorious ride!
I really do not see the reason for all the disputation. Everyone has different priorities in selecting their optimum automotive transport. Mine yielded the phenomenal 545i, but I am not going to diss those who believe that the Lexus or Infiniti better suits their needs.
I do wonder, though, why those who bought the e60 and then found it lacking feel the need to come onto this message board and act as though anyone who loves the car is a dolt. Look in the mirror, boys, if you want to see who is to blame for your dissatisfaction. Extraordinary reliability has never been the calling-card of BMW, and so if you expect it from a 5-series today you are likely to be unhappy with your choice.
I do wonder, though, why those who bought the e60 and then found it lacking feel the need to come onto this message board and act as though anyone who loves the car is a dolt. Look in the mirror, boys, if you want to see who is to blame for your dissatisfaction. Extraordinary reliability has never been the calling-card of BMW, and so if you expect it from a 5-series today you are likely to be unhappy with your choice.
04-07-2006, 06:19 PM
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Originally Posted by MaxBuck' post='266186' date='Apr 7 2006, 07:06 PM
I really do not see the reason for all the disputation. Everyone has different priorities in selecting their optimum automotive transport. Mine yielded the phenomenal 545i, but I am not going to diss those who believe that the Lexus or Infiniti better suits their needs.
I do wonder, though, why those who bought the e60 and then found it lacking feel the need to come onto this message board and act as though anyone who loves the car is a dolt. Look in the mirror, boys, if you want to see who is to blame for your dissatisfaction. Extraordinary reliability has never been the calling-card of BMW, and so if you expect it from a 5-series today you are likely to be unhappy with your choice.
I do wonder, though, why those who bought the e60 and then found it lacking feel the need to come onto this message board and act as though anyone who loves the car is a dolt. Look in the mirror, boys, if you want to see who is to blame for your dissatisfaction. Extraordinary reliability has never been the calling-card of BMW, and so if you expect it from a 5-series today you are likely to be unhappy with your choice.
04-07-2006, 07:10 PM
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Originally Posted by MaxBuck' post='266186' date='Apr 7 2006, 08:06 PM
I really do not see the reason for all the disputation. Everyone has different priorities in selecting their optimum automotive transport. Mine yielded the phenomenal 545i, but I am not going to diss those who believe that the Lexus or Infiniti better suits their needs.
I do wonder, though, why those who bought the e60 and then found it lacking feel the need to come onto this message board and act as though anyone who loves the car is a dolt. Look in the mirror, boys, if you want to see who is to blame for your dissatisfaction. Extraordinary reliability has never been the calling-card of BMW, and so if you expect it from a 5-series today you are likely to be unhappy with your choice.
I do wonder, though, why those who bought the e60 and then found it lacking feel the need to come onto this message board and act as though anyone who loves the car is a dolt. Look in the mirror, boys, if you want to see who is to blame for your dissatisfaction. Extraordinary reliability has never been the calling-card of BMW, and so if you expect it from a 5-series today you are likely to be unhappy with your choice.