Possible class action
01-01-2005, 07:18 AM
#12
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Originally Posted by pharding' date='Jan 1 2005, 12:02 AM
Don't sue BMW on my behalf.? The literature, manual, BMW web site, etc., all say BMW can change features at any time.? That is good enough for me.? Furthermore why would anyone trust a salesperson?
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Uh Oh ... we're stoking the nearly extinguished embers here !!!
You are correct that BMW has the "right" to change specifications in their vehicles. However, consumers also have the "right" of being informed of such changes so they may make an informed decision whether or not to purchase a product that has been altered from that advertised.
If there is substantive data showing that BMW promised Bluetooth functionality in MY 2004 vehicles, then dfndr may have a case worth purSUING. I dont believe such data exists. Furthermore, the verbal speculation of a salesman regarding Bluetooth (unless committted to contract paperwork) is essentially heresay.
That being said, BMWs apparent unwillingness to provide Bluetooth functionality for some of their most loyal consumers (early purchasers of the E60) is nothing short of SHAMEFUL. The lack of information available to owners regarding handsfree solutions in these early MY E60's is equally SHAMEFUL.
The CPT9000 is too old to be considered has-been technology, and is figuratively a T-Rex. At least BMW could provide the means for "wired" use of a bluetooth phone in the E60 (in a docking cradle) so that owners are not required to purchase two phones with two different phone #'s: - an antique v60 CDMA to use in their E60, and a modern GSM bluetooth phone to use everywhere else. Is this the pinnacle of German engineering we are told to expect from the folk at BMW ???
SAD ...
01-01-2005, 08:38 AM
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Originally Posted by pharding' date='Jan 1 2005, 01:02 AM
Don't sue BMW on my behalf.? The literature, manual, BMW web site, etc., all say BMW can change features at any time.? That is good enough for me.? Furthermore why would anyone trust a salesperson?
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BMW should not be blamed for not having it before the Bluetooth Standards have been ratified. Most of the cell phones on the market don't have it, and those that do (Verizon being the perfect example) haven't got their act together yet.
01-01-2005, 09:24 AM
#14
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Originally Posted by wnrussell' date='Jan 1 2005, 12:38 PM
[quote name='pharding' date='Jan 1 2005, 01:02 AM']Don't sue BMW on my behalf.? The literature, manual, BMW web site, etc., all say BMW can change features at any time.? That is good enough for me.? Furthermore why would anyone trust a salesperson?
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BMW should not be blamed for not having it before the Bluetooth Standards have been ratified. Most of the cell phones on the market don't have it, and those that do (Verizon being the perfect example) haven't got their act together yet.
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[/quote]Bluetooth not ready for prime time ?
How come many other automakers have gotten it right, while BMW has not ?
Lets face it, BMW has screwed this one up (it is not a failure of the technology). This issue has more to do with BMW forcing their inferior Assist product upon consumers while forgetting about the more important issue of wireless communucation and handsfree technology.
01-01-2005, 11:02 AM
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A sales person is an agent of the dealer, the dealer an agent of BMW NA, BMW NA an agent of BMW.
Anyone ever heard the word fraud? Inducing someone to buy something based on some piece of technology being operational and then having a story told about how the "technology" is having problems is only an attempt by the manufacturer to get the customer from moving forward through the complaint/legal process.
All corporations have legions of lawyers to protect and promote their interests 24/7. For anyone to state that citizens should not pursue any legal cause that is substantiated by facts should also recognize that BMW can avert all of this by upgrading all the E60's that don't have bluetooth, a free upgrade.
My 10/03 build came with a bluetooth card. When I asked the sales rep about it, he stated that there was a process to go through to get it activated. What happened?
Anyone ever heard the word fraud? Inducing someone to buy something based on some piece of technology being operational and then having a story told about how the "technology" is having problems is only an attempt by the manufacturer to get the customer from moving forward through the complaint/legal process.
All corporations have legions of lawyers to protect and promote their interests 24/7. For anyone to state that citizens should not pursue any legal cause that is substantiated by facts should also recognize that BMW can avert all of this by upgrading all the E60's that don't have bluetooth, a free upgrade.
My 10/03 build came with a bluetooth card. When I asked the sales rep about it, he stated that there was a process to go through to get it activated. What happened?
01-01-2005, 11:21 AM
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Originally Posted by TMC' date='Jan 1 2005, 03:57 AM
I don't agree with litigious culture you have over there, but it very much IS BMW's fault in this case.
Supposing the salesman had sold you cruise control, and intimated (like that very famous idiotic case) that you could put it on CC and just go to sleep or something.? You (presuming you're from Alabama) put it in CC and go to the back seat and open a few brews.? Car crashes, you have whiplash.
The power of the sue culture in the States would very much make it BMW's fault in this case, and I suspect would do in the BT case, were it more 'cut and dried' than it currently is.? All sorts of variables are involved, including (in no small part) the phone service providers, manufacturers etc.
I'm at a crossroads in ordering my 5 series.? I do want bluetooth, and I suspect any salesman will swear blind that my beloved model of phone will be compatible - but I don't take their word for it, and neither should anyone, IMO.
I do get a bit disheartened at the amount of posts in here threatening / promising court action over any small defect in these cars.? Is this a world we want to live in?
Supposing the salesman had sold you cruise control, and intimated (like that very famous idiotic case) that you could put it on CC and just go to sleep or something.? You (presuming you're from Alabama) put it in CC and go to the back seat and open a few brews.? Car crashes, you have whiplash.
The power of the sue culture in the States would very much make it BMW's fault in this case, and I suspect would do in the BT case, were it more 'cut and dried' than it currently is.? All sorts of variables are involved, including (in no small part) the phone service providers, manufacturers etc.
I'm at a crossroads in ordering my 5 series.? I do want bluetooth, and I suspect any salesman will swear blind that my beloved model of phone will be compatible - but I don't take their word for it, and neither should anyone, IMO.
I do get a bit disheartened at the amount of posts in here threatening / promising court action over any small defect in these cars.? Is this a world we want to live in?
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01-01-2005, 11:32 AM
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Originally Posted by EBMCS03' date='Jan 1 2005, 02:21 PM
BMW dealers are individually owned and not all owned by BMW so its up to the dealer to know what the hell they're selling. BMW is only providing the car being sold. So if you're going to sue, sue the dealer and your salesman. People in the US are too SUE happy...
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Who is SUE
BMW should provide a solution to its customers; its plain & simple...
01-01-2005, 11:47 PM
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BMW is responsible for the problem since the product came out of their factory. Same would hold for a baby crib manufacturer that produced a faulty crib where a baby got hurt. Sueing the crib retailer/distributor would not get you anywhere.
01-01-2005, 11:56 PM
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Originally Posted by Jimbo' date='Jan 2 2005, 12:47 AM
BMW is responsible for the problem since the product came out of their factory. Same would hold for a baby crib manufacturer that produced a faulty crib where a baby got hurt. Sueing the crib retailer/distributor would not get you anywhere.
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now if BMW advertised it saying it was compatiable with ALL BT phones and is available to ALL E60s then ok.
01-02-2005, 06:48 AM
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Though I would love to get Bluetooth it was never advertised to me. After the Mercedes fiasco where they promised everyone navigation in their cars, couldn't deliver and then had to buy back thousands of cars I believe my dealership and BMW has been very careful about promising anything. So does anyone have anything in writing showing that we'd all be able to get Bluetooth?