porsche911targa

Pittsburgh fans, you really need to read and understand this:

http://content.usatoday.com/communit...ade-in-2000s/1

And I quote Bill Cowher from the above link:
"Listen, there's people stealing signals all the time before that. You have ways to hide those things. We had wristbands for our defense. I remember trying to get offensive plays and see what the formations were. Everybody knows."

The more you make an issue out of this the less you validate your own team, so might as well accept the fact that this is the way things were done and move on. Yes, they got caught, but Cowher admitted that he did it too. Does the fact that he didn't get caught make him less of a "cheater?"

It's like the guy who gets busted for drug possesion and then your neighbor says "Oh yeah, I snort cocaine all the time, but I've never got caught." Does that make your neighbor less guilty because he never got caught?

The Steelers were the best team of the 70's and the Patriots were the best team of the 00's. The Patriots had their run and now it's some other team's turn to shine.

I will be forever appreciative that I was able to see the Boston teams shine during the past, fantastic decade. We saw 3 Superbowl wins, 2 World Series wins, and 1 NBA championship win. Boston fans were the luckiest fans in the country boasting more successful teams than any other states. Not bad for one of the smallest states in the union.

After this much success, it's going to be hard possibly going back to middle of the road, but with the Krafts still owning the Patriots one never knows. Maybe they're done and maybe they have another SB win or two in the near future. Let's see how all those number one picks they've been amassing pan out.

pjinca

LOL Pittsburgh of the 70's was the best team in NFL history - 4 titles (back to back twice), not to mention beating "America's Team" TWICE in the big game. 11 total hall of famers from that team and 9 of the NFL's 75th anniversary team starters.

Now about the cheating, which other team has been embarrassed and fined for cheating? Which other owner and coach have been fined for cheating? Um, none. And is there any surprise that SINCE they were caught they have won diddly squat?

Boston having "the most successful sports teams"? Um, if you mean total championships - New York would beg to differ (at last count the Yankees alone have more than all the teams in Boston); if you mean Per Capita - Pittsburgh could lay claim to that title - with the Penguins, Pirates, and Steelers owning 14 champoinships (Pens 3, Pirates 5, Steelers 6) for a truly small city that is remarkable. Even stating that Mass. is one of the "smaller states in the union" is ridiculous when your neighbors (Rhode Island, Connecticut, New Hampshire, and Vermont) would tend to disagree with that.

Iceman

What he describes that everyone does is not the same the Pats did.
Everybody "scouts" his opponent.
But getting caught filming them during the game from inside the team zone, in example, is different and clearly cheating/unsportsmanlike conduct. Therefore they got fined.

Rudy

And the fact that Bill Cowher, the Rooney's (as well as the entire Steeler organization), and many, many, others are towing the company (NFL) line and claiming it didn't affect the outcome of any games is understandable given that a scandal such as this could undermine the league as a whole which would hit these people where it hurts the most...their wallets!

Clearly, Pats fans will cling to whatever story helps them sleep at night and I'm sure nothing I say will change their opinions, just like nothing they say (or point me to) will change my opinion that the Pats cheated (which is not the same as the teams that may have bent a few rules over the years) and that -- in many football fans' eyes -- their record is tarnished because of it. The NFL fined them, took away a first-round draft pick and then went and destroyed the video evidence to protect the entity as a whole. I don't disagree with the business decisions behind what the NFL did -- they did what they had to do and their damage control plan worked for the most part. It's no different than some of the stuff NASCAR does when they constantly adjust the rules -- even mid-season -- to help maintain their image and attempt to provide a product that sells.

I was at the AFC Championship game where the Pats beat the Steelers and it was clear to me that in many cases, their defense knew what play was coming before the ball was even snapped. It'll be very interesting to see, many years from now, what some of the "insiders" may say in some sort of exclusive exposé after they realize that they have nothing to lose by telling the truth (and they realize that someone will pay them dearly for them to tell the truth!)

Again, this is an argument that isn't worth debating much more since there are clearly two camps and neither are likely to be persuaded away from what they currently believe in...

(BTW, my original post never actually made the claim that the Steelers were the team of the decade nor did I say the Pats weren't, I was simply saying that when a ranking is determined, all the facts need to be weighed and there's no disputing the fact that the Pats were punished for cheating during that time...)

Alpine White Girl

when did this thread go back to the 70's? i thought we were talking about the nfl from 2000-2009

porsche911targa

"LOL Pittsburgh of the 70's was the best team in NFL history"

I was only talking about the 2000-2009 decade.

"Now about the cheating, which other team has been embarrassed and fined for cheating? Which other owner and coach have been fined for cheating?"

None, because the Pats were the only team that were caught that year. I am sure that they would have caught more later in the year, but the rest of them saw what New England was put through and got smarter about it.

"Boston having "the most successful sports teams"? Um, if you mean total championships - New York would beg to differ (at last count the Yankees alone have more than all the teams in Boston);"

No, I meant only for the 2000-2009 decade. The Yankees only have two titles in the 2000-2009 decade (same as the Red Sox), so your math is wrong.

"Even stating that Mass. is one of the "smaller states in the union" is ridiculous when your neighbors (Rhode Island, Connecticut, New Hampshire, and Vermont) would tend to disagree with that."

None of those states have professional teams. I don't see your logic.

Anyway, I don't care any more. My posting on this thread is over. It was a great decade for sports in Massachusetts, one that most states will never experience and I am glad that I was alive in this era to witness it all.

Go Celtics!!!!

sportzfan76

Patriots* Suck !

It took almost 40 years for that loser franchise to win anything.... and then when they finally did win it was all tainted.

Between the bogus TUCK RULE - which was a fumble by the way - without inconclusive evidence to overturn the original call on the field - to all of
Bellicheat's antics with camera-gate over the next several years - there never was a dynasty.

Get over it - they are a second tier franchise that the entire nation despises.

C's Bimmer

You're not even from New England, per another thread where you said you're not. Jumping on the bandwagon, eh?

porsche911targa

I've lived here 30+ years, so I guess that makes me an adopted "New Englander." Now I know how Yankees fans feel. I think having the whole country hate your team is great. It feels empowering and it makes the rest of the country look silly how they try to rationalize their teams' shortcomings and the "advantages" your team has over their teams.

With the Yankees the talk is all about the biggest payroll of the league, the steroids, the signals stealing, etc. and with the Patriots it's all about a meaningless taping of a walk through where teams don't even throw all their stuff out there. If it makes people feel good about that, so be it. All that matters is that New England fans were blessed for having the best team of the 2000-2009 decade. Somebody mentioned that they were bad the first 40 years. Who cares? They became a great team and dominated the past decade. Period. End of story. We all know that Toyotas sucked the first few decades, then became great, and now suck again. It's a cycle. We had our fun in the sun and now may be somebody else's turn. I don't care. I lived through the best decade of Massachusetts sports history and there are many generations before me, and perhaps after, who cannot make the same claim.

I forgot to mention in an earlier response to PJinca. They have not won a SB since the accident, but that is due largely in part to the fact that the 2 best offensive and defensive coordinators in the league left. They did, however, have an undefeated regular season where they shattered several records including most TD's thrown by a QB and most TD's by a single receiver. Yes, we know they lost the big game, but they kept it close and just ran out of gas.

This is what it comes down to: America loves losers and hates winners. As long as America keeps hating the Patriots it means that they're still a threat to the entire NFL. When/if America starts loving the Patriots, I'll know that they really suck.
Please America, keep hating the Patriots......

C's Bimmer

Actually, 30+ years works for me. OK, you're from NE and not a bandwagon fan. Hahahaha!