You're probably right, like to think that I would have some higher standards in that case but which high profile player ever left us for the competition. I hate Shockey so that doesn't count but let's say Pierce did decide to have the surgery after being cut and went on to MLB for the Eagles or Skins... I'd root for him and respect him despite wanting his team to lose, simple as that.


Lifelike cut-off sleeve hoodie[sup]TM[/sup] included!

 

The use of cameras inside the team area was prohibited even before the 2007 season.

 

Again, unless you or John were there, there was only one incident where that took place, and that incident was before the first game in 2007. Why is everybody still talking about it? Because the Pats are still winners and on top of a very tough division. Why isn't anybody making a big deal out of the Broncos doing the same thing 4 years after the Pats? Because the Broncos are not on top of anything and we all know we love losers in our country......

Good things come to those who wait. Three SB rings for the Pats, this decade. They will still own the Stealers and the Stealers fans will keep bringing up Spygate to make themselves feel better about their team being the Patriots' be-yotch... Same ol', same ol'.

 

the Broncos were also honorable enough to fire their coach and the taping was one of the reasons for it

Also, the other incident they are punished for was taping the Steelers signals before the 2004 AFC championship game, and taping the Rams walkthrough prior to their first tainted SuperBowl, so to say it was an "isolated incident" is delusional.

 

Unless you were there and saw those incidences or the tape, it never happened, just like you maintain Rottenburger's innocence because none of us saw it. Rottenburger was fined and so were the Pats. Does that prove guilt? You make the call. The Broncos needed any excuse to fire the guy. Heck, they would have fired him if he'd short-changed a girl-scout during the cookie drive. Enjoy being the Pats' little play-toys for the decade.

 

I'll still take 30+ years of excellence over a single decade anyway. And there really is no classier organization in the NFL than the Steelers and th Rooney family. As for the accusations(since that's what they were, Ben was never charged with anything as I recall), there were 2 and you referred to 3 - even the story you linked said "3" but then went on to refer to only 2: 1 of which was really just some chick trying to get cash and the other is up for debate (I'll never agree that any NFL QB, or any professional for that matter should be still trying to party with college kids, you gotta grow up eventually).

As for the Cheatriots? I'd be more inclined to listen to any fan of theirs that was a fan prior to 2000, anyone since can be disregarded as a bandwagoner. Even I can give Alpine White Girl credit for being a Chiefs fan through thick and thin, as a Steelers fan of over 30 years i can respect that, besides unlike the Cheatriots the Chiefs have a long winning tradition and I like teams with history.

 

I've been a fan since the Steve Grogan days, I guess I qualify.... Don't forget that the Pats came late into the game, but they have been a very solid, consistent team under the Kraft ownership and since the Parcell days in '93. Like the Rooney family, the Kraft family can be considered classy and all-business. Bob Kraft is a fan first and an owner second. If the Pats don't win a SB soon, Belichiek will be gone soon. Already, I heard a comment from Kraft regarding the game plan against the Jets that is a little uncharacteristic of him. I think he's sending a message. My guess is, Belichiek will end up in Atlanta, if his friend Bon Jovi buys the team.

Under the Krafts, the Pats will continue to be a top, elite team in the NFL, regardless of who coaches it. Here's an exert from his biography: "By his fifth anniversary as owner, the Patriots had already established themselves as perennial playoff contenders, qualifying for the postseason four times, twice as division champions. In 1996, the Patriots claimed their first division title in 10 years. After defeating Pittsburgh in the playoffs, the Patriots hosted their first conference championship game in franchise history and advanced to Super Bowl XXXI." BTW, Belichiek was not in that playoff game against the Stealers.

Read more at: http://www.patriots.com/team/index.c...ecsbio&bio=547

Winning the SB is the ultimate goal, but it's not the only way to measure a team. Dan Marino has never won a Superbowl, but I think he's one of the greatest QB's ever, if not the best.

All kidding aside, it really is amazing how one family took a perennial losing team and transformed it into a force to be reckoned with. Even your Steelers have had difficulty against the Pats, before and after the excuse you like to use. As a fan of football you should at least acknowledge that much.

Admittedly, we're not as fanatic about our teams here as you are in Pittsburgh, because we also have the Celtics (most championships ever), and the Red Sox (consistent and entertaining team with the long history that you prefer and a couple of recent WS championships), the one and only team who owned the Yankees after being down three games in the playoffs).

The Bruins are middle of the road, but can be entertaining, and heck, even our soccer team, that nobody follows, is a perennial playoff contender. Beside all that, we also have other venues of entertainment that you just don't have in Pittsburgh. We also have indoor plumbing, sewer service, electricity, doctors, dentists, and the Internet, so I understand your frustrations and the excuses behind them.

I don't remember a TV blackout since the Kraft took over, but I do remember plenty of TV blackouts before that time frame. As for the history, you are watching history in the making. Three SB wins in the '10s or I'll eat my handkerchief.....

 

Yes, I can agree the Patriots have turned things around under Kraft.I think, quite honestly, Belicheat needs to move on and be successful elsewhere to be truly considered a Hall of Fame coach, similar to Joe Torre who sucked everywhere he went but got into the right organization with the right players (none of whom he acquired) and won with the Yankees, soon as he left? He sucked again with the Dodgers. If belicheat is to truly overcome Spygate, he will need to do something like his mentor Bill Parcells did: take multiple teams to the playoffs/Super Bowl, until he does that he isn't truly a great coach. Add to the scandal his pathetic coaching tree (Magina, McDaniels, Weiss, Crenel - all of them suck) and it's hard to make a case for him. All other great coaches had successful assistants Walsh (Holmgren), Parcells (Belicheat) , Dungy (Tomlin) all had successful assistant coaches
BTW, I am not from Pittsburgh, I grew up in Denver, but I always loved the tough and physical style of play the Steelers use. I am sure the residents of Pittsburgh here can comment on the living conditions there (Rudy our SUPER Mod is one resident).

 

after his 6-0 start he was like 6-20, im sure that had nothing to do with it. Im sure the fact he traded Peyton Hillis for Brady Quinn had nothing to do with it either.

They used the tapings as an excuse. He was getting fired either way. His trades were terrible. He traded up to get Tebow and D Thomas (the wr they drafted before tebow in the first rd) wasnt performing.

 

Finally, something we can agree on. As much as we tend to give coaches credit, a coach is only as good as the organization behind him. Belichik may or may not be a good coach, but I believe that as long as the Krafts own the team, the Pats will be a strong force, regardless of who coaches the team (as I stated earlier). I'd personally like to see Bill Cower return to the NFL and coach the Patriots. I admired his intensity and genuine will to win games. I predict two more years for Belichick in New England and then he's out, if he does not bring another SB.

This banter has been fun. Let's do this again next year, when you guys will make fun of the Pats for winning another Superbowl under "Belicheat."

On to basketball now.... Go Celtics!!!!