pjinca

No worries, I didn't take it personally. This was just one of those mods where I cared less about looks than I did about performance. Kind of like my coilovers, the KSports happen to be attractive, but that was no where near the top of the list of requirements when I got them.

Diamond

Come on folks if this made a big difference why wouldnt bmw put this on a sport pack car? They go to the trouble of designing an advanced anti-roll active bar system but they wouldnt slap a 100 dollar bar on the engine bay if it really made a difference.

Placebo effect at its greatest!

Gene

^please list your mods and why BMW did not provide you with them straight from the factory? As I'm pretty sure the same statements can be made towards your aftermarket mods...

point being, yes it is your opinion that this mod does not work, but until one can provide some lap times or agility testing measures to either verify or deny this products advertised claims, everything is open for personal opinion and discussion.

I think the main question regarding this product: has anyone tracked there cars before and after this mod, or at least tried some sort of individual handling testing pre and post install.

Diamond

I am not trying to put down anyones mods, I actually was wondering why bmw would not put this kind of thing on a stock sport package-
1.Its really cheap and if bmw bought in bulk it wuld be reallly cheap for them
2. It signifigantly feels more "planted" and lessens roll per teh OP
3.You cannot see it as its under the hood
4.Does not do anything negative to the car (no tradeoff)

Now if all those are true than to me it just makes no sense than bmw wouldnt use it but instead develop active rool stabilization-a million dollar design venture to address roll in big saloons..

Your arguement about other mods actually does not hold true since 95 percent of peoples mods have some trade-off from OEM-whether it is looks/exterior mods, stiffer ride, cosmetics etc-All things that take away from the OEM look and feel. This type of bar would take away nothing and only add something hypothetically.

Just curious--why dont they use it?

Gene

A big percentage of aftermarket parts are designed to improve the look and feel of OEM. So that in fact is what this part is attempting to do, improve the feel/performance. Like a wider wheel stance via spacers or just a higher OEM offset, or an aftermarket air filter vs the OEM filter. Piggyback tune to improve performance vs OEM ecu mapping, etc...

IMO, most OEM parts and specs tend to play towards the masses rather than enthusiasts, such as members here, as it's a numbers game. Would few extra thousand s (in terms of mass production/installation) in overhead justify including a strut bar rather than not. Perhaps to the masses and number crunchers, ARS and a slightly lowered suspension is enough marketing hype to think their suspension is a top of the line sport suspension. A small fraction of BMW/e60 owners I would think would question and perhaps choose to add parts to further improve upon OEM specs/parts.

Regarding: " It signifigantly feels more "planted" and lessens roll per the OP" . Like we always state, how it feels is very subjective. Of course there will be some positive placebo with any after product one purchases as we are always looking for that instant feedback and verification that our money was well spent. Kind of like with sprint boosters, powerboxes, secondary cat deletes, etc....we are looking for that "improvement"....

again, would love to see some measurements to see if this product does what it's supposed to do.

dbae1978

Diamond, have you tracked your 5 series? judging by your reply, i doubt it. I tracked my M5 several times and i can assure you the stock setup was way to soft for the track. I had to modify the stock suspension, sacrificing comfort for performance. Manufacturers tend to produce products that are fit for the street. BMW balances comfort along with performance to satisfy their target demographic. A track vehicle is the complete opposite, zero comfort all performance. A strut bar would make the stock vehicle too stiff for the majority of E60 drivers, thus BMW does not provide one for you.

Diamond

Gosh its really hard to not be an asshole when people are just so absolutely stupid. Did you even read the post or my comments before you reply an answer that has nothing to do with my point.

I never said the oem car is as good as it gets from the factor and there is not big room for performance improvement. My point is almost all aftermarket mods, including performance enhancers such as suspension, comes at the cost of reducing oem ride comfort, quiet sound (for exhausts) or exterior mods (which changes OEM look which like it or not bmw chose the exterior appearence for their reasons.)

My point is this piece of metal on the strut braces has absolutely NO downside to the quality, comfort or perforamnce of the oem car. Yet it "increases performance". Anytime you get something for nothing it begs the question whether it does anything.

Now if the strut bar signifigantly deteriorated ride quality for performance than it would make more sense that it did something signifigant.

However bmw always has made the max performance at the certrain comfort level they select with their sport packages. They want a certain comfort level and then pack in the max performance they can at that comfort point.

So changing your suspension you admitted made your car less comfortable, and that is my point. It changes OEM in favor of performance.

Now if someone found a suspension setup that had better performance with no change to comfort, ride etc than that would be a comparable example.

Bottom line is this strut brace is cheap, detracts nothing from OEM car or handling and has no downsides---bmw would have used it if it had a performance benefit.

thanks for playing

jasperxli

please gtfo diamond

pjinca

First off Diamond, you're a douchebag and a retard.
If YOU had actually read my post, I DID state I have coilovers set very stiff in the first place. Therefore, I may have sacrificed something in terms of ride comfort - if my suspension was stock to begin with, but it's not. This is not just some "placebo effect" as you call it, I rightly stated that I could feel as well as hear the chassis twist and creak prior to installation BECAUSE my coilovers were setup stiffer than most would like. The "after" results I am pleased with is that the creaking from the front around the windshield is gone and yes the front does feel more planted. How do I know you may ask? Well, have you ever tracked a car - any car - ever? I have, I was an active SCCA weekend racer for a few years, so yeah you learn a little about suspension feel, and the car's attitude when you track as I, DBae, and others have done. So before you blasting someone as stupid learn a thing or 2 about something you know nothing about.

In short Diamond, I sincerely hope you get banned yet again (what is it 4 times from here and another few times from the M3 forum as well now?). You seem to be good at quoting numbers that can be found easily through any google search, but you don't seem to know a damn thing about anything in the real world. Move out of your mom's basement and go experience something real for once.

jasperxli