Starter works SOMETIMES
01-01-2014, 07:20 AM
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My Ride: 2005 BMW 545i Sports Package
Starter works SOMETIMES
Just like the title says. I have had this problem since the dealership when I purchased it in Dec 18th. The salesman said that I have to press the brakes hard for it to start. It was a little awkward but it worked while I was test driving it...of course.
Fast Forward 3 weeks
I may have found the solution. I heard from a friend that told me something about the steering wheel locking before you can start it, something about some safety feature that the Germans thought was a freaggin smart move.
I have successfully started the car for a while now and wanted to let others know who may have experienced something like this.
All I do now is
1.) Insert Key
2.) Turn to A/C [headlights turn on if it's on AUTO]
3.) Press Brakes
4.) Wiggle the wheel [turn it left and right] ** the extra retarded step I have to do **
5.) Turn the Key in Full to start
This has been working so far. If someone finds this helpful, weird/ or an impending doom of something breaking feel free to chime in!
~ Shar
Fast Forward 3 weeks
I may have found the solution. I heard from a friend that told me something about the steering wheel locking before you can start it, something about some safety feature that the Germans thought was a freaggin smart move.
I have successfully started the car for a while now and wanted to let others know who may have experienced something like this.
If you're car just clicks and no start and everything else works and checks out e.g. headlights, ac, radio, no errors and you have checked that battery and alternator THIS IS FOR YOU!!!
All I do now is
1.) Insert Key
2.) Turn to A/C [headlights turn on if it's on AUTO]
3.) Press Brakes
4.) Wiggle the wheel [turn it left and right] ** the extra retarded step I have to do **
5.) Turn the Key in Full to start
This has been working so far. If someone finds this helpful, weird/ or an impending doom of something breaking feel free to chime in!
~ Shar
01-01-2014, 10:37 AM
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My Ride: '06 530i, '07 C280 4matic, '98 ML320
Insert the key in the ignition, press on brake pedal and move the shifter to N (Neutral) and try starting the car. Does the car start without any problem?
01-04-2014, 12:59 PM
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So far what I've been doing has been working like a charm. I'll try that method though. I'll keep you posted.
~ Shar
~ Shar
01-07-2014, 07:00 AM
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pcy, It has been 3 days since I have tried your suggestion and there were a few times where I would just hear a "click" and the car will not start.
Currently the method I mentioned above works 100%, although this is probably not what other people do I'll have to keep doing this or else my car won't start [without problems]. If some of you bright and beautiful enthusiasts can chime in I'd be very grateful.
BTW...the dealer continues to say "press your brake pedals harder"
~ Shar
Currently the method I mentioned above works 100%, although this is probably not what other people do I'll have to keep doing this or else my car won't start [without problems]. If some of you bright and beautiful enthusiasts can chime in I'd be very grateful.
BTW...the dealer continues to say "press your brake pedals harder"
~ Shar
01-07-2014, 08:02 AM
#5
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The dealer is telling you to press the brake harder because there is a microswitch that must be closed before the CAS will release the car to start (goes back to the Audi 5000's unintended acceleration in the mid-80's if you are old enough to remember that). The same switch is used to release the gear shift lever after the car is started.
If you skip your step #4, which is the only unusual step in the list, I assume the car won't start. In the steering column there is a lock that prevents the steering wheel from being turned when the key is out of the ignition. On some cars once there are some miles on the car after removing the key if you move the steering wheel it will turn slightly and then you hear a click and the wheel is locked. The locking mechanism which is beginning to show wear, is now engaged. On a number of cars I have also experienced if the car is parked with the wheels turned all the way to one side, the ignition key won't turn unless the steering wheel is moved, which again engages a lock or pin that then released the ignition lock.
My guess without researching it is that there is a similar mechanism on the BMW, and in addition to locking the steering wheel physically there is a switch involved.
Try this: After you turn the car off and remove the key, jiggle the steering wheel as you have been doing in step #4. Then skip step #4 the next time you start the car and see if it starts. If so you physically engaged the switch, which is now ready when you go to start the car the next time.
In any case, if skipping step #4 of jiggling the steering wheel, either before or after inserting the key is the only thing that is preventing the car from starting, then the answer is in your steering column.
Enter "steering column" as a search phrase on this and any other BMW forums you frequent and see what comes up. It is a very rare problem that someone else hasn't already experienced and commented on.
If you skip your step #4, which is the only unusual step in the list, I assume the car won't start. In the steering column there is a lock that prevents the steering wheel from being turned when the key is out of the ignition. On some cars once there are some miles on the car after removing the key if you move the steering wheel it will turn slightly and then you hear a click and the wheel is locked. The locking mechanism which is beginning to show wear, is now engaged. On a number of cars I have also experienced if the car is parked with the wheels turned all the way to one side, the ignition key won't turn unless the steering wheel is moved, which again engages a lock or pin that then released the ignition lock.
My guess without researching it is that there is a similar mechanism on the BMW, and in addition to locking the steering wheel physically there is a switch involved.
Try this: After you turn the car off and remove the key, jiggle the steering wheel as you have been doing in step #4. Then skip step #4 the next time you start the car and see if it starts. If so you physically engaged the switch, which is now ready when you go to start the car the next time.
In any case, if skipping step #4 of jiggling the steering wheel, either before or after inserting the key is the only thing that is preventing the car from starting, then the answer is in your steering column.
Enter "steering column" as a search phrase on this and any other BMW forums you frequent and see what comes up. It is a very rare problem that someone else hasn't already experienced and commented on.
Last edited by BimmerFan52; 01-07-2014 at 08:07 AM.
01-08-2014, 06:10 AM
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BimmerFan52
Although I was born in 87, my gramps did own a few Audi's, one of them in fact being the mentioned 5000's. I remember him telling me, when he was teaching me to drive stick, to stick my feet UNDER the brake pedal and push out before I started driving...it has forever been imbedded in my mind and I sometimes find myself still doing it.
It is a very rare problem that someone else hasn't already experienced and commented on.
I begin to realize that more and more each day. I may just try what you mentioned BimmerFan52, I have a feeling you are right and it might just be the steering wheel. How do I tell the dealer this though? I sound like a retard explaining it to people...they just don't get it
~ Shar
Although I was born in 87, my gramps did own a few Audi's, one of them in fact being the mentioned 5000's. I remember him telling me, when he was teaching me to drive stick, to stick my feet UNDER the brake pedal and push out before I started driving...it has forever been imbedded in my mind and I sometimes find myself still doing it.
It is a very rare problem that someone else hasn't already experienced and commented on.
I begin to realize that more and more each day. I may just try what you mentioned BimmerFan52, I have a feeling you are right and it might just be the steering wheel. How do I tell the dealer this though? I sound like a retard explaining it to people...they just don't get it
~ Shar
01-08-2014, 10:21 AM
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BimmerFan52
Although I was born in 87, my gramps did own a few Audi's, one of them in fact being the mentioned 5000's. I remember him telling me, when he was teaching me to drive stick, to stick my feet UNDER the brake pedal and push out before I started driving...it has forever been imbedded in my mind and I sometimes find myself still doing it.
It is a very rare problem that someone else hasn't already experienced and commented on.
I begin to realize that more and more each day. I may just try what you mentioned BimmerFan52, I have a feeling you are right and it might just be the steering wheel. How do I tell the dealer this though? I sound like a retard explaining it to people...they just don't get it
~ Shar
Although I was born in 87, my gramps did own a few Audi's, one of them in fact being the mentioned 5000's. I remember him telling me, when he was teaching me to drive stick, to stick my feet UNDER the brake pedal and push out before I started driving...it has forever been imbedded in my mind and I sometimes find myself still doing it.
It is a very rare problem that someone else hasn't already experienced and commented on.
I begin to realize that more and more each day. I may just try what you mentioned BimmerFan52, I have a feeling you are right and it might just be the steering wheel. How do I tell the dealer this though? I sound like a retard explaining it to people...they just don't get it
~ Shar
Did you try my suggestion and do the wheel jiggling after you complete your drive and remove the key to see if the steering wheel will be "ready" for the next restart without jiggling the steering wheel?
Second question is does it not start every time if you don't jiggle the steering wheel or is it only occasional. One of the most common phrases dealers write on their shop orders are "Cannot duplicate customer Complaint" and it can be frustrating. In order to get the dealer to fix it you may have to hang out at the dealership until it does not start, and then drag the service adviser out by his ear to view the car not starting, and how by jiggling the wheel that suddenly makes it starts.
The other thing you want to do if it hasn't already been done, and if you are still under a warranty, is again go back to the dealership and make an appointment and have the problem documented. If it gets worse two months from now you will have the service order to document that it is not a new problem.
After the warranty is up I would advise you to use caution when going a BMW dealer. Some dealers are very knowledgeable and very fair, while many others will charge you high rates and perform work that may not be required. There are a good number of independent repair shops that specialize in BMWs in your area that will provide quality work for substantially less.
Again, possibly pertinent to the age of the car, steering column problems can range from replacement of the key lock or pin all the way to replacement of the entire steering column which gets very pricey. Not only are the parts expense but taking the steering column apart is very labor intensive.
If you pass the warranty period without the dealer fixing it and it is an older car, you may not want to put money into correcting a problem that many would consider minor if the steering otherwise operates correctly and the repair was $2000 to $3000.
The switch on my 545i steering column which operates the wheel tilt is sometimes intermittent, and needs to be moved two or three times before the steering wheel begins to move. It may only require a little contact cleaner and I will pull it apart when I get time. But it could also require an expensive component replacement on a ten year old car, so I have to weigh is it worth it, since I drive the car 98% of the time and am aware of the idiosyncrasy? Otherwise the car drives flawlessly and is an absolute monster to drive.
01-10-2014, 06:28 AM
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BimmerFan52
Year is 2005, 545i
Did you try my suggestion and do the wheel jiggling after you complete your drive and remove the key to see if the steering wheel will be "ready" for the next restart without jiggling the steering wheel?
I have been doing your method for 2 days now and it has been working 100%.
If I don't do the "jiggle" method it will start occasionally.
Second question is does it not start every time if you don't jiggle the steering wheel or is it only occasional. One of the most common phrases dealers write on their shop orders are "Cannot duplicate customer Complaint" and it can be frustrating. In order to get the dealer to fix it you may have to hang out at the dealership until it does not start, and then drag the service adviser out by his ear to view the car not starting, and how by jiggling the wheel that suddenly makes it starts.
The other thing you want to do if it hasn't already been done, and if you are still under a warranty, is again go back to the dealership and make an appointment and have the problem documented. If it gets worse two months from now you will have the service order to document that it is not a new problem.
After the warranty is up I would advise you to use caution when going a BMW dealer. Some dealers are very knowledgeable and very fair, while many others will charge you high rates and perform work that may not be required. There are a good number of independent repair shops that specialize in BMWs in your area that will provide quality work for substantially less.
I am honestly thinking that at this point in time, I do not want to go to the dealer. But for informative sake, I did buy the car on Dec 18th, 2013 so I am still under that 30 day warranty. I also purchased the 2 year warranty that covers engine and transmission but no electronics, not sure if thats called the "extended" warranty.
San Francisco does have one, BMW SF in the city. But they are always busy....Should I maybe just drop in without an appointment?
There are a few indy BMW shops that I knew within a 40 min to an hour drive from me but I don't know if it's worth it.
Again, possibly pertinent to the age of the car, steering column problems can range from replacement of the key lock or pin all the way to replacement of the entire steering column which gets very pricey. Not only are the parts expense but taking the steering column apart is very labor intensive.
If you pass the warranty period without the dealer fixing it and it is an older car, you may not want to put money into correcting a problem that many would consider minor if the steering otherwise operates correctly and the repair was $2000 to $3000.
That's exactly why I may not even go to a dealer. But I am thinking of doing the paddle shift steering column swap in the future...hopefully I don't open a can of worms there.
My E60 drives flawlessly and I enjoy every single inch of pavement I get drive it on. I am in love with the torque as well! Something I have been missing in a very long time.
~ Shar
Year is 2005, 545i
Did you try my suggestion and do the wheel jiggling after you complete your drive and remove the key to see if the steering wheel will be "ready" for the next restart without jiggling the steering wheel?
I have been doing your method for 2 days now and it has been working 100%.
If I don't do the "jiggle" method it will start occasionally.
Second question is does it not start every time if you don't jiggle the steering wheel or is it only occasional. One of the most common phrases dealers write on their shop orders are "Cannot duplicate customer Complaint" and it can be frustrating. In order to get the dealer to fix it you may have to hang out at the dealership until it does not start, and then drag the service adviser out by his ear to view the car not starting, and how by jiggling the wheel that suddenly makes it starts.
The other thing you want to do if it hasn't already been done, and if you are still under a warranty, is again go back to the dealership and make an appointment and have the problem documented. If it gets worse two months from now you will have the service order to document that it is not a new problem.
After the warranty is up I would advise you to use caution when going a BMW dealer. Some dealers are very knowledgeable and very fair, while many others will charge you high rates and perform work that may not be required. There are a good number of independent repair shops that specialize in BMWs in your area that will provide quality work for substantially less.
I am honestly thinking that at this point in time, I do not want to go to the dealer. But for informative sake, I did buy the car on Dec 18th, 2013 so I am still under that 30 day warranty. I also purchased the 2 year warranty that covers engine and transmission but no electronics, not sure if thats called the "extended" warranty.
San Francisco does have one, BMW SF in the city. But they are always busy....Should I maybe just drop in without an appointment?
There are a few indy BMW shops that I knew within a 40 min to an hour drive from me but I don't know if it's worth it.
Again, possibly pertinent to the age of the car, steering column problems can range from replacement of the key lock or pin all the way to replacement of the entire steering column which gets very pricey. Not only are the parts expense but taking the steering column apart is very labor intensive.
If you pass the warranty period without the dealer fixing it and it is an older car, you may not want to put money into correcting a problem that many would consider minor if the steering otherwise operates correctly and the repair was $2000 to $3000.
That's exactly why I may not even go to a dealer. But I am thinking of doing the paddle shift steering column swap in the future...hopefully I don't open a can of worms there.
My E60 drives flawlessly and I enjoy every single inch of pavement I get drive it on. I am in love with the torque as well! Something I have been missing in a very long time.
~ Shar
01-10-2014, 07:39 AM
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I am still not clear if the dealer you bought it from is a BMW dealer. If not, then the documentation of the problem while under warranty won't mean as much. I think you are resigned to sitting in the parking lot where you bought it until it won't start so you can prove it to them, if you have any hope of them paying for it. And if you didn't buy it from a BMW dealer then I agree that you do not want to go near one now, unless the extended warranty covers it.
You can also examine whether the extended warranty is good and if not they can be dropped for refund so you can look for a better warranty which might cover the car more completely. Mileage will be important.
Regarding the paddle shifters I would be cautious of trying to turn the automatic transmission into a "semi-manual". Quite a number of posters on this and the other popular forum have posted about problems with an automatic transmission after repeatedly trying to drive it like a stick. While the ZF transmission is pretty solid if it gets proper care (trans fluid changes every 50K miles are recommended, even though BMW calls it a "lifetime fluid") like any transmission as they get up in age they grow more touchy as parts wear. And of course you would never get your money back at resale if you did modify the steering column to paddle shifters.
IMHO you would be better off driving it a few years and then if the itch to do manual shifting is still strong, sell it and get one with a manual trans. If you like shifting, a manual 8 cylinder 5 series is about as sweet as it comes.
When I get time I will do a little investigation into the steering column mechanism that locks the wheel and in turn releases the ignition system to start. Or if any other reader has been through this problem and knows the solution please chime in.
Best of luck.
You can also examine whether the extended warranty is good and if not they can be dropped for refund so you can look for a better warranty which might cover the car more completely. Mileage will be important.
Regarding the paddle shifters I would be cautious of trying to turn the automatic transmission into a "semi-manual". Quite a number of posters on this and the other popular forum have posted about problems with an automatic transmission after repeatedly trying to drive it like a stick. While the ZF transmission is pretty solid if it gets proper care (trans fluid changes every 50K miles are recommended, even though BMW calls it a "lifetime fluid") like any transmission as they get up in age they grow more touchy as parts wear. And of course you would never get your money back at resale if you did modify the steering column to paddle shifters.
IMHO you would be better off driving it a few years and then if the itch to do manual shifting is still strong, sell it and get one with a manual trans. If you like shifting, a manual 8 cylinder 5 series is about as sweet as it comes.
When I get time I will do a little investigation into the steering column mechanism that locks the wheel and in turn releases the ignition system to start. Or if any other reader has been through this problem and knows the solution please chime in.
Best of luck.
01-10-2014, 08:38 AM
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BimmerFan52,
First off, thanks for the fast responses!
I did buy the car at a BMW Dealership which is 40 minutes away from me. So in short are you saying it is worth it to drop by?
You can also examine whether the extended warranty is good and if not they can be dropped for refund so you can look for a better warranty which might cover the car more completely. Mileage will be important.
I'll definitely do that. Does this mean that I can change my warranty? Didn't know that if you can. I would like a more complete warranty if that is indeed possible. The mileage is 91,xxx
Regarding the paddle shifters I would be cautious of trying to turn the automatic transmission into a "semi-manual". Quite a number of posters on this and the other popular forum have posted about problems with an automatic transmission after repeatedly trying to drive it like a stick. While the ZF transmission is pretty solid if it gets proper care (trans fluid changes every 50K miles are recommended, even though BMW calls it a "lifetime fluid") like any transmission as they get up in age they grow more touchy as parts wear. And of course you would never get your money back at resale if you did modify the steering column to paddle shifters.
You're right, I just really like the design. Maybe just swap to this?
BMW Performance Steering Wheel - Genuine BMW 32302165395 | FCP Euro
Sorta out of topic but still pertaining to a steering wheel LoL
Thanks again! And if anyone of you has this experience or answers I would really appreciate it.
~ Shar
First off, thanks for the fast responses!
I did buy the car at a BMW Dealership which is 40 minutes away from me. So in short are you saying it is worth it to drop by?
You can also examine whether the extended warranty is good and if not they can be dropped for refund so you can look for a better warranty which might cover the car more completely. Mileage will be important.
I'll definitely do that. Does this mean that I can change my warranty? Didn't know that if you can. I would like a more complete warranty if that is indeed possible. The mileage is 91,xxx
Regarding the paddle shifters I would be cautious of trying to turn the automatic transmission into a "semi-manual". Quite a number of posters on this and the other popular forum have posted about problems with an automatic transmission after repeatedly trying to drive it like a stick. While the ZF transmission is pretty solid if it gets proper care (trans fluid changes every 50K miles are recommended, even though BMW calls it a "lifetime fluid") like any transmission as they get up in age they grow more touchy as parts wear. And of course you would never get your money back at resale if you did modify the steering column to paddle shifters.
You're right, I just really like the design. Maybe just swap to this?
BMW Performance Steering Wheel - Genuine BMW 32302165395 | FCP Euro
Sorta out of topic but still pertaining to a steering wheel LoL
Thanks again! And if anyone of you has this experience or answers I would really appreciate it.
~ Shar