SMG
12-18-2006, 09:59 AM
#41
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Originally Posted by pennetta' post='368361' date='Dec 17 2006, 05:38 PM
But the SMG's benefits are less about stomping the accelerator to the floor for 5.3 sec than they are for road racing from point A to point B. Keeping both hands on the steering wheel as you are racing through S-turns and shifting mid-turn, with the SMG's rev matching, to get in the right gear for an explosive exit is closer to the point. Also there is no way you can consistently shift equal or faster than a SMG without missing a lot of gears in the process, maybe you can do it for one 5.3 sec run, but put a couple run back-to-back and your missing shifts and time with the manual.
Let me be clear here, I have nothing against SMG, I just don't like the obvious jerkiness and vulnerable clutch if card is driven hard. If you drive a stick, you can still modulate clutch gently even when you drive fast. Sporty character of SMG Vs. Steptronic in vehicle I currently own (550i) is not that evident as 0-100 time difference is 0.1 sec only. I'll rather have silky smooth change, thank you. Recently I was invited for Porsche World Roadshow, driven 997 911Turbo...classic auto box.
You must also realize, old auto boxes had torque converter lock only on overdrive or in top gear, now they lock in every gear, hence consumption and performance equals standard SMG or Manual box.
12-18-2006, 10:04 AM
#42
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I'll rather have silky smooth change, thank you.
Then learn how to drive it properly. I promise you, the SMG can be silky smooth during shifts. It just has to be driven the right way. That is no different than a true manual. If you drive it properly, you get smooth shifts. If you don't, you get jerks and stalls. It's not much different, other than you use 1 foot instead of 2.
If you don't like SMG... fine. But I don't want people to get the wrong idea about the technology. The SMG is a manual transmission, and requires a skilled operator to use it to the full potential.
12-18-2006, 10:14 AM
#43
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Originally Posted by w8pmc' post='368352' date='Dec 17 2006, 03:57 PM
The final HUUUUUGE plus is European Launch Control, which once you've selected the correct set-up, allows you to hold the car at just pver 4K RPM & the car just dumps the clutch & Nirvana is reached. Not greatly useful for Sprints, but nothing on earth looks or sounds better than an M5 launching correctly.
Indeed, M5 is sex on wheels.
I am holding my horses, waiting for new M3, had 335i (twin turbo) for couple of hours, awesome performance (with steptronic), I can only (maybe not) imagine new M3 (DSG or SMG)....so old 530d will go for trade in.
On DSG note, my mate is driving new Golf with DSG box.....it is super smooth, I wonder why BMW didn't go that way ?
Two clutches, heavier, more complicated, less reliable that SMG ?
12-18-2006, 10:23 AM
#44
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My Ride: 2006 BMW M5, Silverstone with black extended leather, brushed aluminium trim, Nav Pro, Logic 7, PDC, 35 % tint.
For the first time ever, I used the SMG D1 program yesterday. I always wondered why it was there. My wife and I were at a Party last night and as I had a few drinks, it was her chance to drive the M5 (for the first time!).
The SMG program D1 felt like an automatic, a lot like D (not DS) in my E60 545. The shifts took longer, but were very smooth. It really drove like a luxury car, and no head bobbing on my part as the passenger. The car did not feel quick at all however, but that can be changed with the flick of one (M) button.
The SMG program D1 felt like an automatic, a lot like D (not DS) in my E60 545. The shifts took longer, but were very smooth. It really drove like a luxury car, and no head bobbing on my part as the passenger. The car did not feel quick at all however, but that can be changed with the flick of one (M) button.
12-18-2006, 03:03 PM
#45
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Originally Posted by mirage.za' post='368744' date='Dec 18 2006, 01:59 PM
If you're shifting mid-turn your fast speed driving ....erm.....no comment.
Let me be clear here, I have nothing against SMG, I just don't like the obvious jerkiness and vulnerable clutch if card is driven hard. If you drive a stick, you can still modulate clutch gently even when you drive fast. Sporty character of SMG Vs. Steptronic in vehicle I currently own (550i) is not that evident as 0-100 time difference is 0.1 sec only. I'll rather have silky smooth change, thank you. Recently I was invited for Porsche World Roadshow, driven 997 911Turbo...classic auto box.
You must also realize, old auto boxes had torque converter lock only on overdrive or in top gear, now they lock in every gear, hence consumption and performance equals standard SMG or Manual box.
Let me be clear here, I have nothing against SMG, I just don't like the obvious jerkiness and vulnerable clutch if card is driven hard. If you drive a stick, you can still modulate clutch gently even when you drive fast. Sporty character of SMG Vs. Steptronic in vehicle I currently own (550i) is not that evident as 0-100 time difference is 0.1 sec only. I'll rather have silky smooth change, thank you. Recently I was invited for Porsche World Roadshow, driven 997 911Turbo...classic auto box.
You must also realize, old auto boxes had torque converter lock only on overdrive or in top gear, now they lock in every gear, hence consumption and performance equals standard SMG or Manual box.
12-19-2006, 06:29 PM
#46
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Originally Posted by subterFUSE' post='368746' date='Dec 18 2006, 11:04 AM
Then learn how to drive it properly. I promise you, the SMG can be silky smooth during shifts. It just has to be driven the right way. That is no different than a true manual. If you drive it properly, you get smooth shifts. If you don't, you get jerks and stalls. It's not much different, other than you use 1 foot instead of 2.
If you don't like SMG... fine. But I don't want people to get the wrong idea about the technology. The SMG is a manual transmission, and requires a skilled operator to use it to the full potential.
If you don't like SMG... fine. But I don't want people to get the wrong idea about the technology. The SMG is a manual transmission, and requires a skilled operator to use it to the full potential.
I second that. if I put in like 30- 50% effort I can get smooth shifts all the time. If I dont try then its a little bobble but not bad... I can shift better in the SMG most of the time than the stupid automatic tranmission in my IS 350 can. I really dont see what the big deal is why is there so many people giving false impressions? I see a lot of comments comming from people who dont have much real time behind the wheel, who just read messageboards repeating what they read from first time drivers or test drivers...
If someone "wants" to learn SMG then I'm positive you can shift smooth as butter... its how much learning time are you willing to put into it... how fast do you learn these stuff but if you're expecting to just mash the gas then, no, it wont be smooth. Its really a person thing. And I'm sure some who do have an SMG and say they cant get it "as smooth as a step" personally as a person arn't as car oriented or "skilled"... I think driving is a natural talent in itself. no matter how hard some people try they are just not as good... so you just have to rate yourself how well do you drive, honestly... how coodinated are you? Do you easily pick up new stuff?
IF you can drive a manual know how to rev match, double clutch then you're more then set. You'll LOVE SMG.
I mean some people know how to drive manuals but dont have the slightest clue on how to rev match or double clutch... driving skills...
12-20-2006, 03:08 PM
#47
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Originally Posted by EBMCS03' post='369351' date='Dec 19 2006, 10:29 PM
I second that. if I put in like 30- 50% effort I can get smooth shifts all the time. If I dont try then its a little bobble but not bad... I can shift better in the SMG most of the time than the stupid automatic tranmission in my IS 350 can. I really dont see what the big deal is why is there so many people giving false impressions? I see a lot of comments comming from people who dont have much real time behind the wheel, who just read messageboards repeating what they read from first time drivers or test drivers...
If someone "wants" to learn SMG then I'm positive you can shift smooth as butter... its how much learning time are you willing to put into it... how fast do you learn these stuff but if you're expecting to just mash the gas then, no, it wont be smooth. Its really a person thing. And I'm sure some who do have an SMG and say they cant get it "as smooth as a step" personally as a person arn't as car oriented or "skilled"... I think driving is a natural talent in itself. no matter how hard some people try they are just not as good... so you just have to rate yourself how well do you drive, honestly... how coodinated are you? Do you easily pick up new stuff?
IF you can drive a manual know how to rev match, double clutch then you're more then set. You'll LOVE SMG.
I mean some people know how to drive manuals but dont have the slightest clue on how to rev match or double clutch... driving skills...
If someone "wants" to learn SMG then I'm positive you can shift smooth as butter... its how much learning time are you willing to put into it... how fast do you learn these stuff but if you're expecting to just mash the gas then, no, it wont be smooth. Its really a person thing. And I'm sure some who do have an SMG and say they cant get it "as smooth as a step" personally as a person arn't as car oriented or "skilled"... I think driving is a natural talent in itself. no matter how hard some people try they are just not as good... so you just have to rate yourself how well do you drive, honestly... how coodinated are you? Do you easily pick up new stuff?
IF you can drive a manual know how to rev match, double clutch then you're more then set. You'll LOVE SMG.
I mean some people know how to drive manuals but dont have the slightest clue on how to rev match or double clutch... driving skills...
12-27-2006, 08:15 AM
#48
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IF you can drive a manual know how to rev match, double clutch then you're more then set. You'll LOVE SMG
If you know how to drive manual like that you will NEVER buy SMG. If you're after fun factor, there's only one box - manual stick.
My point is - SMG is not quicker that Steptronic (fact), it is more complicated (fact), it is less comfortable in everyday (70% city traffic, 29.9% Motorway and 0.1% track). It requires 0 (zero) skill, you engage it into drive and either flick paddles or let it change by itself (another fact). To get it to shift smoother also requires 0 (zero) skill, all you have to do is back off throttle before you flick the paddle - any pimpled kid playing Playstation can do it perfectly.
Why is it so difficult to admit that on any car but M3/M5/M6 (fast, great handling, good brakes, clued up driver) it makes for good marketing (F1 technology) but it practical terms doesn't bring anything that tangible ?
Happy New 2007 !
If you know how to drive manual like that you will NEVER buy SMG. If you're after fun factor, there's only one box - manual stick.
My point is - SMG is not quicker that Steptronic (fact), it is more complicated (fact), it is less comfortable in everyday (70% city traffic, 29.9% Motorway and 0.1% track). It requires 0 (zero) skill, you engage it into drive and either flick paddles or let it change by itself (another fact). To get it to shift smoother also requires 0 (zero) skill, all you have to do is back off throttle before you flick the paddle - any pimpled kid playing Playstation can do it perfectly.
Why is it so difficult to admit that on any car but M3/M5/M6 (fast, great handling, good brakes, clued up driver) it makes for good marketing (F1 technology) but it practical terms doesn't bring anything that tangible ?
Happy New 2007 !
12-27-2006, 09:08 AM
#49
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My Ride: 2008 550, Carbon Black Metallic, Natural Brown Dakota Leather, Sport Package, Sport Automatic Transmission, Cold Weather Package, Power Rear and Manual Side Sun Shades, etc.
Retired - 2004 545 SMG, Black Sapphire Metallic, Auburn Dakota Leather, Cold Weather and Sports Packages, Power Rear and Manual Side Sun Shades
Originally Posted by mirage.za' post='371466' date='Dec 27 2006, 12:15 PM
IF you can drive a manual know how to rev match, double clutch then you're more then set. You'll LOVE SMG
If you know how to drive manual like that you will NEVER buy SMG. If you're after fun factor, there's only one box - manual stick.
My point is - SMG is not quicker that Steptronic (fact), it is more complicated (fact), it is less comfortable in everyday (70% city traffic, 29.9% Motorway and 0.1% track). It requires 0 (zero) skill, you engage it into drive and either flick paddles or let it change by itself (another fact). To get it to shift smoother also requires 0 (zero) skill, all you have to do is back off throttle before you flick the paddle - any pimpled kid playing Playstation can do it perfectly.
Why is it so difficult to admit that on any car but M3/M5/M6 (fast, great handling, good brakes, clued up driver) it makes for good marketing (F1 technology) but it practical terms doesn't bring anything that tangible ?
Happy New 2007 !
If you know how to drive manual like that you will NEVER buy SMG. If you're after fun factor, there's only one box - manual stick.
My point is - SMG is not quicker that Steptronic (fact), it is more complicated (fact), it is less comfortable in everyday (70% city traffic, 29.9% Motorway and 0.1% track). It requires 0 (zero) skill, you engage it into drive and either flick paddles or let it change by itself (another fact). To get it to shift smoother also requires 0 (zero) skill, all you have to do is back off throttle before you flick the paddle - any pimpled kid playing Playstation can do it perfectly.
Why is it so difficult to admit that on any car but M3/M5/M6 (fast, great handling, good brakes, clued up driver) it makes for good marketing (F1 technology) but it practical terms doesn't bring anything that tangible ?
Happy New 2007 !
Why is it so difficult for people who do not own an SMG to admit that the SMG has many tangible benefits? And why do people who do not own one feel the need to bash it? I have owned BMW's with all 3 transmissions. I now have nearly 25,000 miles on my SMG and I can honestly say it is my favorite tranny. It was not at first, as there was a learning curve (even for someone who can heel / toe a stick). But now it is clearly my favorite. Your comments that the SMG takes no skill to drive and has no tangible benefits evidences your ignorance and bias (fact). Why not just say "Having never owned one I do not understand the appeal."
12-28-2006, 07:23 AM
#50
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Originally Posted by robg' post='371484' date='Dec 27 2006, 01:08 PM
Why is it so difficult for people who do not own an SMG to admit that the SMG has many tangible benefits? And why do people who do not own one feel the need to bash it? I have owned BMW's with all 3 transmissions. I now have nearly 25,000 miles on my SMG and I can honestly say it is my favorite tranny. It was not at first, as there was a learning curve (even for someone who can heel / toe a stick). But now it is clearly my favorite. Your comments that the SMG takes no skill to drive and has no tangible benefits evidences your ignorance and bias (fact). Why not just say "Having never owned one I do not understand the appeal."
Yea, I agree...Whats up with the SMG bashing from non SMG owners...IMHO you shouldnt even be posting under this thread if you do not currently have an SMG. I have had all three gear boxes and think the SMG is the best. If you dont own one, how can you have an opinion
