SaintK

Yep BMW JUST released progman 20.02. BUT I read what this version fixes and it has nothing to do with what we're all discussing here. Also I don't know if reloading the software will fix the problem. I'm not sure but if programming failed at any point stuff wouldn't work. We had a car that was interrupted while programming and it wouldn't even start. But again I'm not sure and reloading might fix the problem. But thing to remember is that you can only program it so many times. The older style DME programming can only be programmed 8 times, the new BMWs with progman can be programmed more (I don't know the exact #) but it is a limited amount.

znod

Thanks Saintk.

cobradav

BMW just released new version of progman. I do not know exactly what the fixes are in this version, but you might want to talk to the dealerships in a week or so.
[/quote]
Are they not using SIB 61 03 05 for E90 PROGMAN or SIB 61 14 03 for E60/E63 PROGMAN releases? You're the second person I've seen say a new version (20.02 on another forum) is out, but I do not see it. I was also told it was for E90 with RAD2. Can u identify the Service Bulletin number?

grogan545

My first step will be to try to get my dealer to do a reload. I have an appointment on Tue. morning. I am going to call back and see if I can make the appointment specifically to try a reload after they do whatever they want to do first.
Yes, if you read above, I learned the same. I think your speedo differences are very close to mine--although I have not yet looked back. Besides going to the dealer, I am going to be looking carefull at when my car starts shifting, especially from 1-2. I did a brief check today, and, sure enough, it appears to start shifting before 6k--maybe significantly so. If you think about it, please try to notice when your car starts the 1-2 shift. Thanks.
I'll keep you posted--one way or another. Thanks.
[/quote]

I am totaly mystified!!This morning I thought I would try something different since I was having such drastic traction problems.I tried some practice starts with DTS/DSC engaged.To my surprise I was able to get some very good starts by lightly brake torqueing(800 rpm) and slowly going to full throttle.Some of the starts were every bit as good as my best with DTS/TSC disengaged.Sometimes I felt the controls taking over and killing power but other times the starts were excellent(no wheelspin but very good acceleration).I also went as far as I could dare in the runs and did get a full 1/4 run once.Check out these times.
speed run 1 ,run2
N S
10 .33 .30
20 1.10 .97
30 1.88 1.70
40 3.00 2.85
50 3.97 3.90
60 5.10 5.25
70 6.60 6.88
80 8.08 8.50
90 9.68 10.40
100 11.65 ----
HP 353 324
60' 2.08 2.00
330' 5.83 5.75
1/8 8.83,83.1mph 8.85,80.4 mph
1000' 11.35 11.48
1/4 13.48,102 mph 13.82,88mph

Much better start on run 2 but it was the slight uphill direction so times slowed as speed increased.Also I let off before the 1/4 mark,therefore the time of 13.82 is slower than actual(only 88 mph).Highest speed reached on this run was 97 mph.

I think this proves that 20.01 did not affect my performance.I hope by redoing your 20.01 it will cure your problem.

znod

Excellent results grogan. Did you notice that I have been able to get 0-10 as low as .25 with everything off and 1k RPM brake torquing? Of course, I had no wheel spin, and this dandy advantage goes away by 20 MPH.

I checked out the MPH that my car starts shiting again this morning. Definitely about true 28 MPH and about true 58 mph. Not good. And, have you eyeballed your MPH shift starting points yet? If you could check on the way home, or whatever, today, then I'd greatly apprediate it. Then, I would have some comparative info for my appointment tomorrow. Thanks if you can get to it.

grogan545

Excellent results grogan. Did you notice that I have been able to get 0-10 as low as .25 with everything off and 1k RPM brake torquing? Of course, I had no wheel spin, and this dandy advantage goes away by 20 MPH.

I checked out the MPH that my car starts shiting again this morning. Definitely about true 28 MPH and about true 58 mph. Not good. And, have you eyeballed your MPH shift starting points yet? If you could check on the way home, or whatever, today, then I'd greatly apprediate it. Then, I would have some comparative info for my appointment tomorrow. Thanks if you can get to it.
[/quote]

Yes I did check at what point my shifts started but I checked rpm' rather than speed.My shift's start at about 5900 rpm.I think I discovered somrthing much more important though.I neglected to say in my previous post that I made my runs in D rather than DS or manual.I am not positve yet but I think by trying to shift manuallyI am running up against the rev limiter.I tried a run in DS without shifting manually and had a time of 5.45 to 60.Again I noticed a big drop in power at the shift(maybe rev limiter).I also noticed in my run 1 that I detected some traction control loss of power,therefore my speeds to 30 and my 60' time is slower than my S run.I believe with the same start as run 2 I may have made a under 5 sec run.

I will research more later,but it appears that leaving the controls engaged for me will result ultimately in better times.Who would have thought?

znod

Thanks grogan, but what I need to know is what your speedo shows--if still possible. But, don't do anything special to get the info; it probably will not help that much. For my car, leaving everything engaged would never have gotten the job done. But, with your wheel spin, I am not overly surprised. Do you think your car actually is stronger after 20?

grogan545

Thanks grogan, but what I need to know is what your speedo shows--if still possible. But, don't do anything special to get the info; it probably will not help that much. For my car, leaving everything engaged would never have gotten the job done. But, with your wheel spin, I am not overly surprised. Do you think your car actually is stronger after 20?
[/quote]

I will check the speedo next time.

Up until today I would have agreed with you about the controls.I remember trying runs when I first got the GT2 with the controls on and the controls took over and slowed the car down very noticably at the start.I don't know if succeding software updates have helped this problem(I started with 11.0 and had 4 more with 20.01 being the last).Believe me it is a blow to my ego to think that I can't do better with my driving skills than BMW with their intrusive controls.This may have nothing to do with your problem but I still think it is worth experimenting with the controls on.When I get the start correct I don't notice any traction controls.

I also am suspicious of the shift/rev limiter situation in the DS mode.It feels to me like I have a larger hesitation and power loss when in DS than in D.Could be I am running up against the rev limiter.

I don't think my car is stronger with 20.01 after 20.I think it is stronger but its due to the cold weather(30 F)

I sent you a pm,let me know your thoughts.

znod

I answered the PM. I definitely am going to try some alternatives. But, still our cars seem very different now. You can still get massive wheel spin, and I now can't get much at all.

Are you saying that you think you are hitting the rev limiter before 6.5k RPM? When, and how, do you think you hit it. I noted in one of my very early posts after 20 that I had found that we do have a rev limiter for sure--a fail safe I presume. Since we have one, I can't imagine why we are not allowed to shift manually and hit it if we don't shift correctly.

But, anyway, I have hit the rev limiter many times now, but not it the way you would think. I can hit it intentionally by holding forward and accelerting moderately all the way beyond 6.5k up to maybe 6.7k--then boom--out of gas or whatever.

grogan545

I answered the PM. I definitely am going to try some alternatives. But, still our cars seem very different now. You can still get massive wheel spin, and I now can't get much at all.

Are you saying that you think you are hitting the rev limiter before 6.5k RPM? When, and how, do you think you hit it. I noted in one of my very early posts after 20 that I had found that we do have a rev limiter for sure--a fail safe I presume. Since we have one, I can't imagine why we are not allowed to shift manually and hit it if we don't shift correctly.

But, anyway, I have hit the rev limiter many times now, but not it the way you would think. I can hit it intentionally by holding forward and accelerting moderately all the way beyond 6.5k up to maybe 6.7k--then boom--out of gas or whatever.
[/quote]

I think I am hitting the limiter at 6500 rpm.I think most rev limiters now are what they call soft limiters.they don't shut down suddenly but reduce power by reducing fuel flow and reducing timing.If you continue on the gas it will eventully hit the "boom".You may be doing yourself a disservice by holding the shifter forward.I believe there is a loss of power gradually as you get to the limit.I didn't say before but my shifts occur at about 6350 in D.

I think we still differ on this one point.I don't think we need max rev's to get the best #'s in the 545.With 6 gears in the trans it is not necessary to rev to max.I know that your torque curve is accurate,but you must take into account what happens during a shift.As the shift starts timing is reduced which in turn reduces power & torque(I think a lot more than your graph shows).The timing comes back gradually after the shift until you are at full power again.If only we could get BMW to allow us to control our own shifting I think I could demonstrate this.I think I shift program to minimize the reduction in timing and allow control over the shift points would be the best modd to help the 545 step.

It goes without saying that none of the above will solve your power loss at the start.Obviously that is another problem,but I am sure you will solve it.