Illogical BMW "Break-in" Recommendation
08-30-2005, 12:04 PM
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Originally Posted by gwf545' date='Aug 30 2005, 11:57 AM
[quote name='ZinMe' date='Aug 30 2005, 01:49 PM']I'm not even certain that BMW recommends a break-in period on the e60.?? My dealer said that BMW no longer recommends it.?? Can anyone point to a document / manual item from BMW that specifies a recommended break-in period for e60s?
[snapback]165220[/snapback]
Break-in period
Moving parts need breaking-in time to adjust to
each other. To ensure that your vehicle continues
to provide optimized economy of operation
throughout an extended service life, we request
that you devote careful attention to the following
section.
Engine and differential
Up to 1,200 miles/2,000 km:
You should attempt to vary both engine and
vehicle speeds. Until the break-in period has
been completed, you should also refrain from
exceeding an engine speed of 4,500 rpm or a
driving speed of 100 mph/160 km/h.
Always obey all official speed limits.
Avoid full-throttle operation and use of the
transmission's kick-down mode during these
initial miles.
Once you have driven 1,200 miles/2000 km, the
engine and vehicle speeds can be gradually
increased.
[snapback]165224[/snapback]
[/quote]AH-HA! Page 107! In black and white. Oh well, too late as I just passed 1,600 miles. Fortunately, I was pretty conservative.
Thanks for looking. Is that a 2005 545i manual?
08-30-2005, 12:55 PM
#12
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Originally Posted by Rudy' date='Aug 30 2005, 02:25 PM
I'm not saying who's right here but I have a problem with the term "experts."? Who's to say who's an expert and who's to say who's not an expert??
Wouldn't BMW be the "experts" on their own engines?? Who are the experts that Bimmer32 is quoting?
You can break the car in any way you choose.? In my case I choose to follow the recommendations of BMW since I feel they are the most qualified to decide what's best for the car they designed and built.
Wouldn't BMW be the "experts" on their own engines?? Who are the experts that Bimmer32 is quoting?
You can break the car in any way you choose.? In my case I choose to follow the recommendations of BMW since I feel they are the most qualified to decide what's best for the car they designed and built.
[snapback]165209[/snapback]
http://mototuneusa.com/break_in_secrets.htm
http://www.cycle-parts.com/forum/showthrea...ode=hybrid&t=83
Talk to people that actually "knows" engine and not people who "experience" engines. "Expert" is my subjective judgement = opinion since I only experience engines and not know them personally.
08-30-2005, 12:59 PM
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Good grief! I can't believe someone who has been here less than a month is arguing about the BMW guidelines on breaking in an engine. I agree with many before me, everyone is going to break their engine in differently, those are merely guidelines BMW gives. Treat your car the way you want it to treat you down the road!
08-30-2005, 01:24 PM
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Originally Posted by ZinMe' date='Aug 30 2005, 02:04 PM
[quote name='gwf545' date='Aug 30 2005, 11:57 AM'][quote name='ZinMe' date='Aug 30 2005, 01:49 PM']I'm not even certain that BMW recommends a break-in period on the e60.?? My dealer said that BMW no longer recommends it.?? Can anyone point to a document / manual item from BMW that specifies a recommended break-in period for e60s?
[snapback]165220[/snapback]
Break-in period
Moving parts need breaking-in time to adjust to
each other. To ensure that your vehicle continues
to provide optimized economy of operation
throughout an extended service life, we request
that you devote careful attention to the following
section.
Engine and differential
Up to 1,200 miles/2,000 km:
You should attempt to vary both engine and
vehicle speeds. Until the break-in period has
been completed, you should also refrain from
exceeding an engine speed of 4,500 rpm or a
driving speed of 100 mph/160 km/h.
Always obey all official speed limits.
Avoid full-throttle operation and use of the
transmission's kick-down mode during these
initial miles.
Once you have driven 1,200 miles/2000 km, the
engine and vehicle speeds can be gradually
increased.
[snapback]165224[/snapback]
[/quote]AH-HA! Page 107! In black and white. Oh well, too late as I just passed 1,600 miles. Fortunately, I was pretty conservative.
Thanks for looking. Is that a 2005 545i manual?
[snapback]165234[/snapback]
[/quote]20045 Series PDF that I downloaded. It's probably still the same for 2005.
08-30-2005, 01:36 PM
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Originally Posted by Vitacura' date='Aug 30 2005, 03:59 PM
Good grief! I can't believe someone who has been here less than a month is arguing about the BMW guidelines on breaking in an engine. I agree with many before me, everyone is going to break their engine in differently, those are merely guidelines BMW gives. Treat your car the way you want it to treat you down the road!
[snapback]165274[/snapback]
08-30-2005, 01:37 PM
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Depending on the posts. This is a BMW forum, why would you come here, register and start badmouthing the BMW break-in period?
08-30-2005, 01:52 PM
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Originally Posted by Bimmer32' date='Aug 30 2005, 12:49 PM
This topic assumes that you know about correct engine break-ins.
I'm laying in bed one night, reflecting all the information I have read about break-in process for new motors. Then I remember BMW's advice and here's what I have came up:
1. FACTS: Racing experts say to do "hard" break-ins to get the most power. Engine may not last. Street experts say to break-in moderately. Just about everyone say NOT to use synthetic oil, but regular oil.
Logic: Break-in moderately because you want the balance of power and lasting. Why does BMW put synethic oil in and tell you not to change the oil until 14K miles?
2. FACTS: Experts say that the break-in process is relatively short - about 20 miles to 100 miles.
Logic: To be liberal, lets say maximum of 500 miles for break-ins. Why does BMW say 1200 miles? Is it because the synthetic oil? Expert say not to use it; additionally, you must change the oil after break-ins.
3. FACTS: Experts say that 2K RPM will not help seal the rings. You must do at least 3K RPM. Varying RPM is advised.
Logic: BMW says to vary speed (maybe RPM too). City driving -? that makes sense if you can put above 2.5K RPM. Highway driving? Varying from 55 mph to 85 mph will attract lots of wanna-be racers - one minute you pass them, the other minute you slow down. Additionally, you would have to shift to vary over 1K RPM difference (2k to 3.5K)
Conclusion:
BMW's break-in process is bogus. First, you don't use synethic oil to break-in because it won't seal as good as regular oil. Second, you need to have an oil change ASAP after a break-in because of the particles in the filters and oil. Third, varying speed won't do the trick because you need at least 3K RPM to seal the rings. So what is BMW trying to do?
1. Cover themselves legal.
2. Ensure that owners don't screw anything up for the first 1200 miles. Extend the probability of something not breaking down sooner.
3. Let owners have the fun by being magnets for wanna-be racers.
In my opinion, BMW already "BROKE-IN" your engine (by way of testing) before it was matched to the car chassis. For some of us who bought the car at 40 Odometer, it was broken-in by customers testing or at the distribution center.
I'm laying in bed one night, reflecting all the information I have read about break-in process for new motors. Then I remember BMW's advice and here's what I have came up:
1. FACTS: Racing experts say to do "hard" break-ins to get the most power. Engine may not last. Street experts say to break-in moderately. Just about everyone say NOT to use synthetic oil, but regular oil.
Logic: Break-in moderately because you want the balance of power and lasting. Why does BMW put synethic oil in and tell you not to change the oil until 14K miles?
2. FACTS: Experts say that the break-in process is relatively short - about 20 miles to 100 miles.
Logic: To be liberal, lets say maximum of 500 miles for break-ins. Why does BMW say 1200 miles? Is it because the synthetic oil? Expert say not to use it; additionally, you must change the oil after break-ins.
3. FACTS: Experts say that 2K RPM will not help seal the rings. You must do at least 3K RPM. Varying RPM is advised.
Logic: BMW says to vary speed (maybe RPM too). City driving -? that makes sense if you can put above 2.5K RPM. Highway driving? Varying from 55 mph to 85 mph will attract lots of wanna-be racers - one minute you pass them, the other minute you slow down. Additionally, you would have to shift to vary over 1K RPM difference (2k to 3.5K)
Conclusion:
BMW's break-in process is bogus. First, you don't use synethic oil to break-in because it won't seal as good as regular oil. Second, you need to have an oil change ASAP after a break-in because of the particles in the filters and oil. Third, varying speed won't do the trick because you need at least 3K RPM to seal the rings. So what is BMW trying to do?
1. Cover themselves legal.
2. Ensure that owners don't screw anything up for the first 1200 miles. Extend the probability of something not breaking down sooner.
3. Let owners have the fun by being magnets for wanna-be racers.
In my opinion, BMW already "BROKE-IN" your engine (by way of testing) before it was matched to the car chassis. For some of us who bought the car at 40 Odometer, it was broken-in by customers testing or at the distribution center.
[snapback]165188[/snapback]
I'm an engineer, and have done (long ago) some consulting work for some of the major auto companies. I am NOT an expert in engine design, but I have over 25 years of mechanical design experience.
First of all, there has never been to my knowledge, a statement from an engineer who is an expert in engine design, that the recommended break-in is not required.
My definition of an expert is an engineer who has extensive experience (20-30 years) in mass production engine design and testing.
None of these 'racers' or people who publish things on their websites would qualify as an expert using this definition. In fact, I would venture to say not one of them has had any experience whatsoever in designing a mass production engine.
If I hear from one of the engineers that lead the design on ANY engine produced by one of the major car manufacturers that the break-in should be anything other than what is recommended, then I might pay attention. Otherwise this is just all noise.
08-30-2005, 02:05 PM
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Originally Posted by Vitacura' date='Aug 30 2005, 02:37 PM
Depending on the posts. This is a BMW forum, why would you come here, register and start badmouthing the BMW break-in period?
[snapback]165295[/snapback]
I don't think we should discourage anyone posting in this forum as long as it's E60 related. Peace.
08-30-2005, 02:16 PM
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i remember this posting before; if you follow the link posted, at the end, it looks like an advertising campaign (for what, i'm not sure; i was not interested).
can someone explain why synthetic oil can be bad? just curious.
can someone explain why synthetic oil can be bad? just curious.
08-30-2005, 02:20 PM
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I don't mean to offend anyone personally and I'm speaking very generally here (with nobody specific in mind) so I hope nobody takes what I'm about to say personally but...
I think that the people who say synthetic oil is bad are the same type of people who think the SMG is bad. Many people simply don't like change and are usually skeptical with regards to something they don't fully understand. It's normal for people to not have a full understanding of newer, high-tech things like synthetic oil, etc. so they resist adopting the newer technology. Eventually, they gain more understanding and slowly adopt it...
I think that the people who say synthetic oil is bad are the same type of people who think the SMG is bad. Many people simply don't like change and are usually skeptical with regards to something they don't fully understand. It's normal for people to not have a full understanding of newer, high-tech things like synthetic oil, etc. so they resist adopting the newer technology. Eventually, they gain more understanding and slowly adopt it...