New MB S-class pre-safe system failed
11-16-2005, 11:46 AM
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Originally Posted by Centurion' post='199003' date='Nov 16 2005, 11:47 AM
You would think someone as big as Mercedes Benz would perform a trial-run of their demonstration before airing on TV, but I'll remain optimistic. I'm sure they ran some tests prior. I just think something else went wrong. Perhaps there was interference coming from the media's equipment while filming/recording the event.
Mercedes stating that it was all the steel surrounding them doesn't make their case look any less idiotic.
At any rate, what is the premise of "Presafe system"? How is it suppose to work?
Mercedes stating that it was all the steel surrounding them doesn't make their case look any less idiotic.
At any rate, what is the premise of "Presafe system"? How is it suppose to work?
[/quote]Yep, vnod, my alter ego surfaced again.
11-16-2005, 01:44 PM
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Originally Posted by Centurion' post='199003' date='Nov 16 2005, 11:47 AM
At any rate, what is the premise of "Presafe system"? How is it suppose to work?
Here's a quote from edmunds.com (http://www.edmunds.com/insideline/do/Featu...rticleId=106121):
Since 2002, the S-Class has been equipped with Mercedes' Pre-Safe system. It works like this: In the seconds just before a possible impact, the front seatbelts are automatically tightened, the sunroof closes, and the seats can move to positions that provide better protection. On the new S-Class, the system has been taken further. Pre-Safe now closes the car's side windows to provide better support for the window curtain airbags, and inflate special seat cushions to provide greater lateral support for occupants and help the side airbags provide even better collision protection.
Also, Distronic cruise control that maintains a preset following distance behind the vehicle ahead will be replaced by an optional Distronic Plus system. Integrated with Pre-Safe, the radar-based system operates at nearly all speeds up to 125 mph. Distronic Plus works with a new Brake Assist Plus system to monitor traffic conditions, and if a collision is anticipated, ideal brake pressure is applied, even if the driver applies the brake pedal too lightly. Mercedes says its studies show the new system reduces rear collisions in heavy city traffic by 75 percent.
Also, Distronic cruise control that maintains a preset following distance behind the vehicle ahead will be replaced by an optional Distronic Plus system. Integrated with Pre-Safe, the radar-based system operates at nearly all speeds up to 125 mph. Distronic Plus works with a new Brake Assist Plus system to monitor traffic conditions, and if a collision is anticipated, ideal brake pressure is applied, even if the driver applies the brake pedal too lightly. Mercedes says its studies show the new system reduces rear collisions in heavy city traffic by 75 percent.
http://www.germancarfans.com/news.cf...id/2050616.005
11-16-2005, 03:22 PM
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This stuff was really funny. I was ROFLMAO about the stupidity of the MB engineers and the involved journalist of one of the major auto magazines.
Here is what happened:
They have this new system what is a combination of the distronic and a brake assistant.
They put two MB's in a row, created fog and let the test driver, a journalist from Auto Bild, drive the car in a straight line into the fog.
The system in the S-class was supposed to see the cars in the fog and give a warning signal and chime. Then the driver is supposed to brake, while the car helps him with the brakes so that he is using the optimal brake force and comes to a complete stop before crashing.
That's the theory...
What happened is, the driver was wired by the TV team and forgott about the mike... You can clearly hear that the warning chime started AFTER the car had crashed!
But... the test driver, who told the TV team that he will not brake before the chime, used the brakes...
So, why did he used the brakes without the chime?
The MB engineers had set up a wooden plank on the floor, so that the S-class runs over it with the right front wheel. THAT was the sign for the test driver to use the brakes...
After the crash you could hear the test driver (the journalist) talking to the MB engineers. They discussed what to say in front of the TV camera... Then the official statement, just what they have discussed before...
Then the test driver demonstrated a couple brakes. ALLWAYS used the brakes when he came to the piece of wood, and said the system gave him the signal to use the brakes, but it never did! The mike was on all the time... no beep!
Then the TV team asked if the camera man can be in the rear seat for the next test run and they (MB engineers) agreed. The test driver immediately took the engineers aside and said that the TV team then will be able to notice the missing beep! Suddenly the MB engineers switched their minds and said it's for the safety of the camera man!
And on the following test run... guess waht... NO beep, and a crash!
The TV magazine is Stern TV, host G?nther Jauch. They had the MB engineer, who is responsible for driver assistance systems, in the studio (live, not taped) and he appologized. His explanation was:
This was the shooting of a staged "movie" what should have been a demonstration of how the system works. Unfortunately, all tests outside the building worked before, but inside the building the system fails due to all the metall in the floor and the the metall wall. So, when they had found out that the system fails inside the building, they put the wood on the floor, so that the driver will not crash without any using of the brake once the system fails. He claimed that the beep was there in four out of ten tests in the building... Anyways... The wood was a safety feature... He claimed... And he appologized for not telling the TV team that the system malfunctions inside the building...
However... A system like that should also work when there is metal out there. Or in a tunnel...
But amazingly the journalist who seemed to care more about MB and their image than on the truth was not available for an interview, not even his boss. They were not even available for a live sat com interview...
Over all... It's an amazing story.
Unbelievable the journalist who was the test driver lied into the camera of another journalist. It's unbelievable that MB was doing this stuff the way they did.
BMW is working on similar systems but is not launching them yet. Seems MB wanted to be ahead, and failed...
Here is what happened:
They have this new system what is a combination of the distronic and a brake assistant.
They put two MB's in a row, created fog and let the test driver, a journalist from Auto Bild, drive the car in a straight line into the fog.
The system in the S-class was supposed to see the cars in the fog and give a warning signal and chime. Then the driver is supposed to brake, while the car helps him with the brakes so that he is using the optimal brake force and comes to a complete stop before crashing.
That's the theory...
What happened is, the driver was wired by the TV team and forgott about the mike... You can clearly hear that the warning chime started AFTER the car had crashed!
But... the test driver, who told the TV team that he will not brake before the chime, used the brakes...
So, why did he used the brakes without the chime?
The MB engineers had set up a wooden plank on the floor, so that the S-class runs over it with the right front wheel. THAT was the sign for the test driver to use the brakes...
After the crash you could hear the test driver (the journalist) talking to the MB engineers. They discussed what to say in front of the TV camera... Then the official statement, just what they have discussed before...
Then the test driver demonstrated a couple brakes. ALLWAYS used the brakes when he came to the piece of wood, and said the system gave him the signal to use the brakes, but it never did! The mike was on all the time... no beep!
Then the TV team asked if the camera man can be in the rear seat for the next test run and they (MB engineers) agreed. The test driver immediately took the engineers aside and said that the TV team then will be able to notice the missing beep! Suddenly the MB engineers switched their minds and said it's for the safety of the camera man!
And on the following test run... guess waht... NO beep, and a crash!
The TV magazine is Stern TV, host G?nther Jauch. They had the MB engineer, who is responsible for driver assistance systems, in the studio (live, not taped) and he appologized. His explanation was:
This was the shooting of a staged "movie" what should have been a demonstration of how the system works. Unfortunately, all tests outside the building worked before, but inside the building the system fails due to all the metall in the floor and the the metall wall. So, when they had found out that the system fails inside the building, they put the wood on the floor, so that the driver will not crash without any using of the brake once the system fails. He claimed that the beep was there in four out of ten tests in the building... Anyways... The wood was a safety feature... He claimed... And he appologized for not telling the TV team that the system malfunctions inside the building...
However... A system like that should also work when there is metal out there. Or in a tunnel...
But amazingly the journalist who seemed to care more about MB and their image than on the truth was not available for an interview, not even his boss. They were not even available for a live sat com interview...
Over all... It's an amazing story.
Unbelievable the journalist who was the test driver lied into the camera of another journalist. It's unbelievable that MB was doing this stuff the way they did.
BMW is working on similar systems but is not launching them yet. Seems MB wanted to be ahead, and failed...
11-17-2005, 03:39 AM
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Ah, as they say, the rest of the story. Thanks for the real inside lowdown Iceman. Actually makes it worse than what it first appeared, a simple failure. Now we have woe and intrigue, collusion as well as collision 
:thumbsdown:
:thumbsdown:
11-17-2005, 05:34 AM
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Originally Posted by Centurion' post='199003' date='Nov 16 2005, 08:47 AM
Mercedes stating that it was all the steel surrounding them doesn't make their case look any less idiotic.
Now, here's the icing on the cake:
Note that in the picture, the cars are bumper to bumper, all 3 of them!
Attachment 12565
What this picture looks like is they left the first two cars from the crash right where they are. Then they proceeded to run the 2nd test without clearing away the first accident, but instead, running a third vehicle into it.
Please tell me that's not how it happened.
11-17-2005, 02:01 PM
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Now, here's the icing on the cake:
Note that in the picture, the cars are bumper to bumper, all 3 of them!
Attachment 12565
What this picture looks like is they left the first two cars from the crash right where they are. Then they proceeded to run the 2nd test without clearing away the first accident, but instead, running a third vehicle into it.
Please tell me that's not how it happened.
Note that in the picture, the cars are bumper to bumper, all 3 of them!
Attachment 12565
What this picture looks like is they left the first two cars from the crash right where they are. Then they proceeded to run the 2nd test without clearing away the first accident, but instead, running a third vehicle into it.
Please tell me that's not how it happened.
The simulation was: The end of a traffic jam on the highway in fog. So, those cars where parked there! The first failed test was with a S-class, the second one two. Those cars you see in front where the "dummies" simulating the end of the traffic jam.
11-17-2005, 05:15 PM
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I wonder how many test cases that test plan had. Do you mean it failed on the first test case?
send it back to unit test. It is not ready for system test.
send it back to unit test. It is not ready for system test.
11-18-2005, 06:35 AM
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Now, here's the icing on the cake:
Note that in the picture, the cars are bumper to bumper, all 3 of them!
Attachment 12565
What this picture looks like is they left the first two cars from the crash right where they are. Then they proceeded to run the 2nd test without clearing away the first accident, but instead, running a third vehicle into it.
Please tell me that's not how it happened.
Note that in the picture, the cars are bumper to bumper, all 3 of them!
Attachment 12565
What this picture looks like is they left the first two cars from the crash right where they are. Then they proceeded to run the 2nd test without clearing away the first accident, but instead, running a third vehicle into it.
Please tell me that's not how it happened.
The simulation was: The end of a traffic jam on the highway in fog. So, those cars where parked there! The first failed test was with a S-class, the second one two. Those cars you see in front where the "dummies" simulating the end of the traffic jam.
[/quote]
OK. Thanks for clarifying that.
Also, how fast do you figure the test car was traveling? 65kmh maybe?