Some of you looked in a mirror today...
09-28-2009, 05:00 PM
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It?s good to see that many people here complained about my posts.
So, you guys don?t want this forum on this level and noticed how annoying it is.
A good thing.
But that?s just a good start.
Amazingly people who are involved react shocked when a mod comes down to their level.
But to be honest, I expected more members to be upset.
Interestingly many members didn't react to the agressivness of my posts... Is it that normal allready?
All right then.
Let?s look back at todays events?
When I read the posts that were made over night, while I was sleeping after a nice election party, I started thinking about how to react properly to wake everyone up. We have tried to wake everyone up over the last few weeks? with not much success? looking at the posts that were made in the last 24 hours.
I chose to react with drastic posts. I even left my partner Rudy in doubt about my motives and my mental condition.
Sorry for that, Rudy.
I am very happy you guys didn?t liked it and accused me of different things such as power abuse and using double standards. And besides there ARE double standards, since for us mods apply higher standards as for the usual member, I can assure you that no animals were harmed in the making of my posts? Ok, just kidding a bit here to get a smile on your face while reading through this serious stuff.
So, some complained, some even PM?ed me and tried to discuss with me. This shows you guys have not yet given up our high standards and were shocked when a moderator posted on such a level.
So far?
Now, the problem still exists and the question is why.
I see well respected members and friends posting in a way that isn?t acceptable. And if someone else would do so they would report him. Whats going on? I really don?t know why we have those problems. Is it really that hard to just be friendly and don?t harass others? We should treat all members equally, with respect, even if they were banned 30 times or if they were caught lying. If there is something fishy or if you have any problem with a member or something he posted, please report it to us mods. Don?t start going after him, that?s unacceptable!
Recently we?ve had way too many incidents and too much talk about it. Threads about respect and rules. Let?s just talk about cars, OK? It?s not that hard?
Why can?t we just sit back, relax and have fun together without discussing behaviours?
Everyone here should treat any other member with all the respect he wants to get himself.
And that?s where we finally talk about double standards.
Many of you guys seem to use double standards.
Veterans don?t respect newbies as they should do, and as it was in the past.
The fact that E60?s are now cheaper and more affordable for the mass is no real excuse.
Even people buying cheaper cars can have high standards, and if not, they will adopt them if this community teaches them with respect? or get in trouble with us mods.
And the way a member that was previously banned got treated here was another example how there are double standards here. He came back and deserved to be heard. Issues with that should have been expressed to the mods, not in public. But instead the guy was shot down, just because he did something wrong in the past. Why can?t we be tolerant here? I know we have been very tolerant in the past, so why did that change? I don?t know, maybe you find an answer.
So, my todays posts here were actually serious but used waaaay too aggressive and obscene language. And those made you guys go ballistic.
Remember that feeling before you post in the future guys!
I simply used language and agressivness that can be found DAILY on our forum!
It?s a shocker when it comes from a moderator isn?t it?
[sarcasm]
And isn?t it a shocker if a new member doesn?t pay tribute to the veterans, those who bought the car when it was more expensive?
And isn?t it a shocker when veterans think they are above the law and can do whatever they want because they are here for much longer than the newbs?
[/sarcasm]
We are using double standards and double moralty every day on the forum and this needs to stop!!!
Treat everyone with the same respect you want to receive. Any problems report to us. Do not take it in your own hands.
If we all follow this simple rules we can have the same atmosphere here on the forum which made it so special in the last couple of years.
We can not afford this behaviour we currently have. Not from veteran members, not from newbies.
The only ones a different standard should be used is us mods. In our case the standards should be and indeed ARE higher.
I really hope the little excursion I took you on was like looking in a mirror. That?s what the intend was. And it was pretty hard playing this role today. Espacially since the reason for it is so dead serious and sad.
So, everyone, let?s continue now. There?s nothing more to see, move on.
But never forget how shocking it was to read messages from a moderator telling people to STFU.
OK?
If you don?t forget the feeling you had when reading my messages above, we are on track!
And don?t forget the content of the messages Rudy and I posted. Just excuse the language I used. The content itself is dead serious!
Thank you for taking the time and reading through this.
And please excuse my last try of showing you how annoying this can be by using such drastic Kindergarten-like measures.
I thought it's worth try...
Let's see...
So, you guys don?t want this forum on this level and noticed how annoying it is.
A good thing.
But that?s just a good start.
Amazingly people who are involved react shocked when a mod comes down to their level.
But to be honest, I expected more members to be upset.
Interestingly many members didn't react to the agressivness of my posts... Is it that normal allready?
All right then.
Let?s look back at todays events?
When I read the posts that were made over night, while I was sleeping after a nice election party, I started thinking about how to react properly to wake everyone up. We have tried to wake everyone up over the last few weeks? with not much success? looking at the posts that were made in the last 24 hours.
I chose to react with drastic posts. I even left my partner Rudy in doubt about my motives and my mental condition.
Sorry for that, Rudy.
I am very happy you guys didn?t liked it and accused me of different things such as power abuse and using double standards. And besides there ARE double standards, since for us mods apply higher standards as for the usual member, I can assure you that no animals were harmed in the making of my posts? Ok, just kidding a bit here to get a smile on your face while reading through this serious stuff.
So, some complained, some even PM?ed me and tried to discuss with me. This shows you guys have not yet given up our high standards and were shocked when a moderator posted on such a level.
So far?
Now, the problem still exists and the question is why.
I see well respected members and friends posting in a way that isn?t acceptable. And if someone else would do so they would report him. Whats going on? I really don?t know why we have those problems. Is it really that hard to just be friendly and don?t harass others? We should treat all members equally, with respect, even if they were banned 30 times or if they were caught lying. If there is something fishy or if you have any problem with a member or something he posted, please report it to us mods. Don?t start going after him, that?s unacceptable!
Recently we?ve had way too many incidents and too much talk about it. Threads about respect and rules. Let?s just talk about cars, OK? It?s not that hard?
Why can?t we just sit back, relax and have fun together without discussing behaviours?
Everyone here should treat any other member with all the respect he wants to get himself.
And that?s where we finally talk about double standards.
Many of you guys seem to use double standards.
Veterans don?t respect newbies as they should do, and as it was in the past.
The fact that E60?s are now cheaper and more affordable for the mass is no real excuse.
Even people buying cheaper cars can have high standards, and if not, they will adopt them if this community teaches them with respect? or get in trouble with us mods.
And the way a member that was previously banned got treated here was another example how there are double standards here. He came back and deserved to be heard. Issues with that should have been expressed to the mods, not in public. But instead the guy was shot down, just because he did something wrong in the past. Why can?t we be tolerant here? I know we have been very tolerant in the past, so why did that change? I don?t know, maybe you find an answer.
So, my todays posts here were actually serious but used waaaay too aggressive and obscene language. And those made you guys go ballistic.
Remember that feeling before you post in the future guys!
I simply used language and agressivness that can be found DAILY on our forum!
It?s a shocker when it comes from a moderator isn?t it?
[sarcasm]
And isn?t it a shocker if a new member doesn?t pay tribute to the veterans, those who bought the car when it was more expensive?
And isn?t it a shocker when veterans think they are above the law and can do whatever they want because they are here for much longer than the newbs?
[/sarcasm]
We are using double standards and double moralty every day on the forum and this needs to stop!!!
Treat everyone with the same respect you want to receive. Any problems report to us. Do not take it in your own hands.
If we all follow this simple rules we can have the same atmosphere here on the forum which made it so special in the last couple of years.
We can not afford this behaviour we currently have. Not from veteran members, not from newbies.
The only ones a different standard should be used is us mods. In our case the standards should be and indeed ARE higher.
I really hope the little excursion I took you on was like looking in a mirror. That?s what the intend was. And it was pretty hard playing this role today. Espacially since the reason for it is so dead serious and sad.
So, everyone, let?s continue now. There?s nothing more to see, move on.
But never forget how shocking it was to read messages from a moderator telling people to STFU.
OK?
If you don?t forget the feeling you had when reading my messages above, we are on track!
And don?t forget the content of the messages Rudy and I posted. Just excuse the language I used. The content itself is dead serious!
Thank you for taking the time and reading through this.
And please excuse my last try of showing you how annoying this can be by using such drastic Kindergarten-like measures.
I thought it's worth try...
Let's see...
09-28-2009, 05:51 PM
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Iceman, I have to admit, I thought you were serious before and was surprised that those posts weren't your usual reasonable tone. As I have said before, a "talking to" by yourself and/or Rudy is effective because you two are too dang reasonable to argue with 
Thanks for clearing it up and thanks again for what you guys do. 
Thanks for clearing it up and thanks again for what you guys do.
09-28-2009, 05:56 PM
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Originally Posted by Iceman' post='1019664' date='Sep 28 2009, 08:00 PM
It?s good to see that many people here complained about my posts.
So, you guys don?t want this forum on this level and noticed how annoying it is.
A good thing.
But that?s just a good start.
Amazingly people who are involved react shocked when a mod comes down to their level.
But to be honest, I expected more members to be upset.
Interestingly many members didn't react to the agressivness of my posts... Is it that normal allready?
All right then.
Let?s look back at todays events?
When I read the posts that were made over night, while I was sleeping after a nice election party, I started thinking about how to react properly to wake everyone up. We have tried to wake everyone up over the last few weeks? with not much success? looking at the posts that were made in the last 24 hours.
I chose to react with drastic posts. I even left my partner Rudy in doubt about my motives and my mental condition.
Sorry for that, Rudy.
I am very happy you guys didn?t liked it and accused me of different things such as power abuse and using double standards. And besides there ARE double standards, since for us mods apply higher standards as for the usual member, I can assure you that no animals were harmed in the making of my posts? Ok, just kidding a bit here to get a smile on your face while reading through this serious stuff.
So, some complained, some even PM?ed me and tried to discuss with me. This shows you guys have not yet given up our high standards and were shocked when a moderator posted on such a level.
So far?
Now, the problem still exists and the question is why.
I see well respected members and friends posting in a way that isn?t acceptable. And if someone else would do so they would report him. Whats going on? I really don?t know why we have those problems. Is it really that hard to just be friendly and don?t harass others? We should treat all members equally, with respect, even if they were banned 30 times or if they were caught lying. If there is something fishy or if you have any problem with a member or something he posted, please report it to us mods. Don?t start going after him, that?s unacceptable!
Recently we?ve had way too many incidents and too much talk about it. Threads about respect and rules. Let?s just talk about cars, OK? It?s not that hard?
Why can?t we just sit back, relax and have fun together without discussing behaviours?
Everyone here should treat any other member with all the respect he wants to get himself.
And that?s where we finally talk about double standards.
Many of you guys seem to use double standards.
Veterans don?t respect newbies as they should do, and as it was in the past.
The fact that E60?s are now cheaper and more affordable for the mass is no real excuse.
Even people buying cheaper cars can have high standards, and if not, they will adopt them if this community teaches them with respect? or get in trouble with us mods.
And the way a member that was previously banned got treated here was another example how there are double standards here. He came back and deserved to be heard. Issues with that should have been expressed to the mods, not in public. But instead the guy was shot down, just because he did something wrong in the past. Why can?t we be tolerant here? I know we have been very tolerant in the past, so why did that change? I don?t know, maybe you find an answer.
So, my todays posts here were actually serious but used waaaay too aggressive and obscene language. And those made you guys go ballistic.
Remember that feeling before you post in the future guys!
I simply used language and agressivness that can be found DAILY on our forum!
It?s a shocker when it comes from a moderator isn?t it?
[sarcasm]
And isn?t it a shocker if a new member doesn?t pay tribute to the veterans, those who bought the car when it was more expensive?
And isn?t it a shocker when veterans think they are above the law and can do whatever they want because they are here for much longer than the newbs?
[/sarcasm]
We are using double standards and double moralty every day on the forum and this needs to stop!!!
Treat everyone with the same respect you want to receive. Any problems report to us. Do not take it in your own hands.
If we all follow this simple rules we can have the same atmosphere here on the forum which made it so special in the last couple of years.
We can not afford this behaviour we currently have. Not from veteran members, not from newbies.
The only ones a different standard should be used is us mods. In our case the standards should be and indeed ARE higher.
I really hope the little excursion I took you on was like looking in a mirror. That?s what the intend was. And it was pretty hard playing this role today. Espacially since the reason for it is so dead serious and sad.
So, everyone, let?s continue now. There?s nothing more to see, move on.
But never forget how shocking it was to read messages from a moderator telling people to STFU.
OK?
If you don?t forget the feeling you had when reading my messages above, we are on track!
And don?t forget the content of the messages Rudy and I posted. Just excuse the language I used. The content itself is dead serious!
Thank you for taking the time and reading through this.
And please excuse my last try of showing you how annoying this can be by using such drastic Kindergarten-like measures.
I thought it's worth try...
Let's see...
So, you guys don?t want this forum on this level and noticed how annoying it is.
A good thing.
But that?s just a good start.
Amazingly people who are involved react shocked when a mod comes down to their level.
But to be honest, I expected more members to be upset.
Interestingly many members didn't react to the agressivness of my posts... Is it that normal allready?
All right then.
Let?s look back at todays events?
When I read the posts that were made over night, while I was sleeping after a nice election party, I started thinking about how to react properly to wake everyone up. We have tried to wake everyone up over the last few weeks? with not much success? looking at the posts that were made in the last 24 hours.
I chose to react with drastic posts. I even left my partner Rudy in doubt about my motives and my mental condition.
Sorry for that, Rudy.
I am very happy you guys didn?t liked it and accused me of different things such as power abuse and using double standards. And besides there ARE double standards, since for us mods apply higher standards as for the usual member, I can assure you that no animals were harmed in the making of my posts? Ok, just kidding a bit here to get a smile on your face while reading through this serious stuff.
So, some complained, some even PM?ed me and tried to discuss with me. This shows you guys have not yet given up our high standards and were shocked when a moderator posted on such a level.
So far?
Now, the problem still exists and the question is why.
I see well respected members and friends posting in a way that isn?t acceptable. And if someone else would do so they would report him. Whats going on? I really don?t know why we have those problems. Is it really that hard to just be friendly and don?t harass others? We should treat all members equally, with respect, even if they were banned 30 times or if they were caught lying. If there is something fishy or if you have any problem with a member or something he posted, please report it to us mods. Don?t start going after him, that?s unacceptable!
Recently we?ve had way too many incidents and too much talk about it. Threads about respect and rules. Let?s just talk about cars, OK? It?s not that hard?
Why can?t we just sit back, relax and have fun together without discussing behaviours?
Everyone here should treat any other member with all the respect he wants to get himself.
And that?s where we finally talk about double standards.
Many of you guys seem to use double standards.
Veterans don?t respect newbies as they should do, and as it was in the past.
The fact that E60?s are now cheaper and more affordable for the mass is no real excuse.
Even people buying cheaper cars can have high standards, and if not, they will adopt them if this community teaches them with respect? or get in trouble with us mods.
And the way a member that was previously banned got treated here was another example how there are double standards here. He came back and deserved to be heard. Issues with that should have been expressed to the mods, not in public. But instead the guy was shot down, just because he did something wrong in the past. Why can?t we be tolerant here? I know we have been very tolerant in the past, so why did that change? I don?t know, maybe you find an answer.
So, my todays posts here were actually serious but used waaaay too aggressive and obscene language. And those made you guys go ballistic.
Remember that feeling before you post in the future guys!
I simply used language and agressivness that can be found DAILY on our forum!
It?s a shocker when it comes from a moderator isn?t it?
[sarcasm]
And isn?t it a shocker if a new member doesn?t pay tribute to the veterans, those who bought the car when it was more expensive?
And isn?t it a shocker when veterans think they are above the law and can do whatever they want because they are here for much longer than the newbs?
[/sarcasm]
We are using double standards and double moralty every day on the forum and this needs to stop!!!
Treat everyone with the same respect you want to receive. Any problems report to us. Do not take it in your own hands.
If we all follow this simple rules we can have the same atmosphere here on the forum which made it so special in the last couple of years.
We can not afford this behaviour we currently have. Not from veteran members, not from newbies.
The only ones a different standard should be used is us mods. In our case the standards should be and indeed ARE higher.
I really hope the little excursion I took you on was like looking in a mirror. That?s what the intend was. And it was pretty hard playing this role today. Espacially since the reason for it is so dead serious and sad.
So, everyone, let?s continue now. There?s nothing more to see, move on.
But never forget how shocking it was to read messages from a moderator telling people to STFU.
OK?
If you don?t forget the feeling you had when reading my messages above, we are on track!
And don?t forget the content of the messages Rudy and I posted. Just excuse the language I used. The content itself is dead serious!
Thank you for taking the time and reading through this.
And please excuse my last try of showing you how annoying this can be by using such drastic Kindergarten-like measures.
I thought it's worth try...
Let's see...
09-28-2009, 06:01 PM
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Originally Posted by pjinca' post='1019692' date='Sep 29 2009, 03:51 AM
Iceman, I have to admit, I thought you were serious before and was surprised that those posts weren't your usual reasonable tone. As I have said before, a "talking to" by yourself and/or Rudy is effective because you two are too dang reasonable to argue with Thanks for clearing it up and thanks again for what you guys do.
Thanks for clearing it up and thanks again for what you guys do. I think I need to make it clear again:
The contents of the messages I posted today were serious.
The way I posted them was intentionally over the top to wake everyone up and let some of the members here look in the mirror and see the ugly face of such offensiveness.
But the messages itself were serious...
09-28-2009, 06:24 PM
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Well said, Iceman!
Yes, in these last months, the forum has been increasingly aggressiveness lately. then you the mods showed up and now everything seems in control.
Yes, in these last months, the forum has been increasingly aggressiveness lately. then you the mods showed up and now everything seems in control.
09-28-2009, 06:26 PM
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Originally Posted by miguex' post='1019723' date='Sep 29 2009, 04:24 AM
... now everything seems in control.
we're just half way there yet...
09-28-2009, 06:44 PM
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Originally Posted by Iceman' post='1019725' date='Sep 28 2009, 08:26 PM
almost...
we're just half way there yet...
we're just half way there yet...
Good! keep that!
09-28-2009, 07:40 PM
#9
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I want to give a big round of thanks and praise to Iceman and Rudy for their hard work since becoming moderators of the forums but most especially over the last month or so. Many of you probably don't know but I was away on vacation for 3 weeks in Poland visiting family with my fiance (hers & mine) in late August and the first half of this month. This was about the time period when things were beginning to get out of control. It's funny how this always seems to happen when I travel. It's not the first time. Anyway, Iceman and Rudy handled things to the best of their ability and I can not find fault in anything they have done. Believe me, it is not easy to "put your foot down". It is impossible to please everyone but we try our best. Thank you Rudy! Thank you Iceman!
I've tried to catch myself up to what's been going on and honestly I'm a little lost because it seems that everyday different people are in some kind of heated discussion. This is inevitable as the forum grows. So I have layed low and let things play out. Finally when I thought things were under control, new drama occurs. I expect the best from everyone here, not only from our senior members but from new members a like. New members should not be bashed on the first question they ask and told to use the search button. Sure they could search, some do, some don't, some think it's exciting to ask a question and get fresh answers. Our new members have just as much excitement about the E60 as we all had and do when we first got the car. As we each own the car for longer and longer, we begin to think that such questions are repetitive and maybe they are to you but not to the person asking. Just remember, each member is in a different period of E60 ownership. I could go on and on but I'll use only that one example.
I would hope that all members would respect each other as you would respect others outside of the Internet. Discipline here has been extremely light and we'd like to keep it that way. We've banned very few members in the last 5 years other than hundreds of spammers. It's my belief that in most volatile situations the members involved need a "cooling off" period which I would hope those members could take on their own as needed to calm their nerves. However, should problems continue, we have discussed possibly using temporary account suspensions for a day, a few days, a week, whatever the time frame but hopefully we won't have to.
I want to end by thanking Iceman & Rudy once again. Everything they do may not be perfect, but who is? I believe we've done an amazing job in running this forum the past many years. New members and old members a like always say how great a community we have here as compared to "other" forums. Lets not become like the "others". We're better than that and lets act like it!
I've tried to catch myself up to what's been going on and honestly I'm a little lost because it seems that everyday different people are in some kind of heated discussion. This is inevitable as the forum grows. So I have layed low and let things play out. Finally when I thought things were under control, new drama occurs. I expect the best from everyone here, not only from our senior members but from new members a like. New members should not be bashed on the first question they ask and told to use the search button. Sure they could search, some do, some don't, some think it's exciting to ask a question and get fresh answers. Our new members have just as much excitement about the E60 as we all had and do when we first got the car. As we each own the car for longer and longer, we begin to think that such questions are repetitive and maybe they are to you but not to the person asking. Just remember, each member is in a different period of E60 ownership. I could go on and on but I'll use only that one example.
I would hope that all members would respect each other as you would respect others outside of the Internet. Discipline here has been extremely light and we'd like to keep it that way. We've banned very few members in the last 5 years other than hundreds of spammers. It's my belief that in most volatile situations the members involved need a "cooling off" period which I would hope those members could take on their own as needed to calm their nerves. However, should problems continue, we have discussed possibly using temporary account suspensions for a day, a few days, a week, whatever the time frame but hopefully we won't have to.
I want to end by thanking Iceman & Rudy once again. Everything they do may not be perfect, but who is? I believe we've done an amazing job in running this forum the past many years. New members and old members a like always say how great a community we have here as compared to "other" forums. Lets not become like the "others". We're better than that and lets act like it!
09-28-2009, 07:43 PM
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Originally Posted by Lomag' post='1019797' date='Sep 28 2009, 11:40 PM
I want to give a big round of thanks and praise to Iceman and Rudy for their hard work since becoming moderators of the forums but most especially over the last month or so. Many of you probably don't know but I was away on vacation for 3 weeks in Poland visiting family with my fiance (hers & mine) in late August and the first half of this month. This was about the time period when things were beginning to get out of control. It's funny how this always seems to happen when I travel. It's not the first time. Anyway, Iceman and Rudy handled things to the best of their ability and I can not find fault in anything they have done. Believe me, it is not easy to "put your foot down". It is impossible to please everyone but we try our best. Thank you Rudy! Thank you Iceman!
I've tried to catch myself up to what's been going on and honestly I'm a little lost because it seems that everyday different people are in some kind of heated discussion. This is inevitable as the forum grows. So I have layed low and let things play out. Finally when I thought things were under control, new drama occurs. I expect the best from everyone here, not only from our senior members but from new members a like. New members should not be bashed on the first question they ask and told to use the search button. Sure they could search, some do, some don't, some think it's exciting to ask a question and get fresh answers. Our new members have just as much excitement about the E60 as we all had and do when we first got the car. As we each own the car for longer and longer, we begin to think that such questions are repetitive and maybe they are to you but not to the person asking. Just remember, each member is in a different period of E60 ownership. I could go on and on but I'll use only that one example.
I would hope that all members would respect each other as you would respect others outside of the Internet. Discipline here has been extremely light and we'd like to keep it that way. We've banned very few members in the last 5 years other than hundreds of spammers. It's my belief that in most volatile situations the members involved need a "cooling off" period which I would hope those members could take on their own as needed to calm their nerves. However, should problems continue, we have discussed possibly using temporary account suspensions for a day, a few days, a week, whatever the time frame but hopefully we won't have to.
I want to end by thanking Iceman & Rudy once again. Everything they do may not be perfect, but who is? I believe we've done an amazing job in running this forum the past many years. New members and old members a like always say how great a community we have here as compared to "other" forums. Lets not become like the "others". We're better than that and lets act like it!
I've tried to catch myself up to what's been going on and honestly I'm a little lost because it seems that everyday different people are in some kind of heated discussion. This is inevitable as the forum grows. So I have layed low and let things play out. Finally when I thought things were under control, new drama occurs. I expect the best from everyone here, not only from our senior members but from new members a like. New members should not be bashed on the first question they ask and told to use the search button. Sure they could search, some do, some don't, some think it's exciting to ask a question and get fresh answers. Our new members have just as much excitement about the E60 as we all had and do when we first got the car. As we each own the car for longer and longer, we begin to think that such questions are repetitive and maybe they are to you but not to the person asking. Just remember, each member is in a different period of E60 ownership. I could go on and on but I'll use only that one example.
I would hope that all members would respect each other as you would respect others outside of the Internet. Discipline here has been extremely light and we'd like to keep it that way. We've banned very few members in the last 5 years other than hundreds of spammers. It's my belief that in most volatile situations the members involved need a "cooling off" period which I would hope those members could take on their own as needed to calm their nerves. However, should problems continue, we have discussed possibly using temporary account suspensions for a day, a few days, a week, whatever the time frame but hopefully we won't have to.
I want to end by thanking Iceman & Rudy once again. Everything they do may not be perfect, but who is? I believe we've done an amazing job in running this forum the past many years. New members and old members a like always say how great a community we have here as compared to "other" forums. Lets not become like the "others". We're better than that and lets act like it!