TexaZ3

http://www.bmwblog.com/2009/10/13/editoria...ory/#more-22051

m630

a sad, but true fact of the world where a MINI ceo runs ///M...only a miracle can turns this nitemare from becoming reality I suppose

swajames

+1, it is indeed sad but true. There's no doubt that these new M engines are going to be stellar, but by adopting forced induction BMW is essentially going with the "me too" philosophy and following Audi and MB who blazed that trail before them. M was always the one that stayed truest to what many consider to be its core principles. Funny how it's now MB that seems to be taking the lead on getting prodigious power (and torque) from a normally aspirated powerplant.

m630

Totally agree and I think this is the point that gets most overlooked...none of us disagree that the new turbo engines won't be great with tons of cheap hp and gobs of torque downlow, they will impress those that don't know anybetter and will be big power showings in the numbers game, its just that's not what M has always stood for and its not what differentiates M from any other offering in the market...many will love it and some will hate it, the real test is if those that luv it are as passionate as those of us that don't...will they return year after year, model after model in a qwest for the turbos like the traditional M buyers, or will they be "nouveau" if you will, where they just attach to the biggest hp/tq winner of any given cycle...in the past its the M traditionalist that have led the feverant desire for the M cars at any cost, regardless of whether they were the biggest hp or tq offering, somehow I doubt the nubies will stay loyal like those of us that followed the 30+years of NA passion, and ultimately this will lead to the ruins of the M that we knew, only when its so far down the wrong path will they wake up and look back with amazement and disgust, wondering how they got so far off track from their roots that have allowed them to grow to what they are(or were)...

TexaZ3

While I totally agree with above posts, the company has to move with the times. Yes it's sad to see the engines we love go to the weigh side, but it is in the interest of something better and more efficient. The world is demanding something more efficient with little to no power loss and what is the solution? forced induction. A technology can only be taken so far until it's unable to be adapted to compete. I predict that in the next 20 years there will be an even bigger shift in what any performance car is powered by.

swajames

No doubt FI is more efficient, but I'm not sure it's necessarily better. These cars sell in comparatively low volumes so it's not going to have much impact on BMW's CAFE obligations, and, frankly, buyers of a 100K car aren't overly concerned with running costs. The two major losses are in the rev range and exhaust note, the current V10 spins to around 8500 RPM whereas the turbo engines top out with a greatly reduced redline and there's no getting away from the fact that the turbo will take the edge off the exhaust. No question that the extra torque will make up for some of the deficit, but at this level I'd take the current RPM and noise over the extra torque.

TexaZ3

Current V10 - 8250 rpm 507 hp
TT V8 - 7000 rpm 555 hp
How often do you drive at 7000 rpm?

m630

That's 515hp@8400RPMs, thankyou!

Nd...More often than you'd imagine, like everyday

And I imagine that you'd never get to the 7K in the turbos without meltdown!

swajames

If i had the V10, it would be every single day.

m630

you absolutely would!


///and checking the dyno on the wannabee.anM.trucks, youd never want to get past 5K-6K in near any situation , while you only get started in the S85 above 5500RPMs!