Patrick E61

I sent that youtube link to my Dad, and his only comment was that he saw a lot of that in 1968 when dealing with ARVN. "It didn't help then, and I doubt that it will make any difference now."

CWS530

Well, that sure changes the tone....

PraiseTheLowered

I respectfully disagree because we don't know if he is in fact an NCO or a junior officer. In either case you have to look at the cause and the endstate of such a speech.

As an officer though, you know very well that you arent suppose to act harshly towards troops, but NCO's do. One of the reasons there is such a big rift between commissioned and enlisted is the assumed intellectual superiority of officers.

Ruf930

Yes, that is the assumed rifted.. however I was a prior-service NCO in SOF for 10 years. This type of behavior is why there are resentful troops hiding in the ranks. Seeing both sides of the picture (NCO and Officer) I think there is a better way to express grief. Because that same Soldier screaming at Soldiers would be the first one they aim at in a fire fight. He'd be shot because he was being a dick. And for the records, officers are not very intellectual - they just know how to put up a good front. Worst decision I made was leaving the NCO Corps.

craigm1841

but that 0-3E pay was pretty sweet when you made CPT though, no? assuming you are there... i have no clue how long you have been an officer for.

Ruf930

Going on LTC now. Money is good, but job satisfaction was better. I used to wake up excited about going to work every morning. Now, I wake up with that "time to make the donuts" feeling. ROTCs and West Pointers are so timid and sensitive that I spend most of my time trying not to offend people by being too direct. So if it walks like a duck, looks like a duck, and quacks like a duck.... I've learned to call it a frog so know one gets upset. This is not the way leadership should be - 19 and 20 year old men and women are dying because of this.

The military leadership is a lot like the general population, 5 / 10 / 85. There is a true 5% of the military who are true Patriots. They come from generations of military and Masonic heritage. Then there is another 10% who understand what the nation is fighting for and demonstrate bravery and patriotism when they could be doing something else with their lives. Then there is 85%. These are a bunch of cowards who watched too many war movies growing up, or read one too many military books, or thought Top Gun, Platoon, and Apocalypse Now were really "cool" movies! These are the guys who are screwing the military up and getting young Soldiers killed.

Check out this story. This Soldier was pissed off at the way the war was going.... so what did he do?

http://www.cnn.com/2009/CRIME/05/11/us.sol...ings/index.html

PraiseTheLowered

Well in regards to ROTC and West Point, Ive seen a lot of officers go through those programs but honestly for ROTC what do you expect? The bottom of the Officer barrel is selected to become PMS in most cases. I have actually seen Captains and Majors harrassing the shit out of cadets because they thought it was funny. That's not their job, thats an NCO job, plus if you are going to ream somebody out you better develop them afterwards so they can unwedge their head from their ass.

Also West Point and ROTC are college kids, they havent gone to basic (which is nothing today) and have no prior military experience in most cases. They are setup to fail because they don't know how unimportant and PL actually is to a Platoon. They are taught they run things so after four years of being told that, what else would you expect them to act like.

Im prior in ROTC right now at a private school, Ive chewed out my PMS who is a captain for acting like that. I have tried really hard to unfuck some of these cadets but until they see what the real army is like, they are doomed to fail.

craigm1841

I was a PSG before I deployed last year and later got out, I am only 26, but I had a 23 year old 2LT PL fresh out of west point. Holy Micromanagement. He was a great guy and meant well and super motivated, but wow, so overbearing that i wanted to rip my hair out. it made it even tougher because really he should have been a PL for a senior NCO with 15 years experience who could properly mentor him. I am not saying I wasnt a good NCO. but a Junior NCO with 5 years in does not have the knowledge base of an E-7 with 10+ years under his belt...

War has caused the individuals in the Army to grow up faster then before. many of my friends get picked up for E-7 or warrant officer around 7 years, long before they are ready. as a nation at war with an ever expanding force. positions need to be filled, this is causing immaturity and lack of knowledge at higher levels which negatively affects soldiers on their way up. As the PSG at the age of 26, 90% of my platoon was younger than me. even as a squad leader, the majority of the squad was older then me.

Moral of my story is, fast bringing up of people who arent ready for their position which ultimately affects the force as a whole. I \was an MI guy, so i could be wrong about the rest of the Army.

I think at this point everyone but Ruf930, PraiseTheLowered, and lightfytr are pretty much lost with all the acronyms. next we will start throwing around fom #'s 5988, 4856, 4187. some things will never leave my head.