Recommended upgrades for a 535iT
03-17-2016, 04:45 AM
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My Ride: 535XiT 6MT
Model Year: 2009
Recommended upgrades for a 535iT
I just took ownership of 2009 535i Touring (manual!) This is being added to our 2011 335d which we have a JBD box on. In comparison, the 535 is down about 200 foot pounds of torque on the diesel, so am looking for some recommendations on power upgrades with the underlying requirement the car be kept relatively quiet. I've done research but have some questions:
Tune
The options in running are: 1) Burger JB4, 2) Cobb, 3) BimmerBoost/MHD flash, 4) Burger JB4 + backend flash.
Since I don't have a PC or Android device, Cobb seems the easiest plug-and-play. JB4 is a little cheaper, has some cool features, but I don't think I'd use them (no E85 near me, I don't use valet, I don't race...) I think the only time I would change map is if I were to upgrade bolt-on components. Power wise JB4 + a backend flash seems to be the best route, but between not needing the features of the JB4, and not having a device to flash myself this option seems extraneous for the added benefits. That said, if there's a compelling argument, I can pick up a cheap laptop.
Intake/Filter
Options are: 1) Drop in filter, 2) dual-cone intake, 3) some dual-cone intake with the shroud (like the AFE.)
This car will be used for long trips, so I don't want a lot of WOOOOSH... I assume a drop in filter is the quietest option? Will that still yield a performance gain that a tune can take advantage of, or do I really need to remove the stock airbox? While doing this I would consider changing the charge pipe as well. Will I see a performance benefit from that? Intercooler will probably be done at some point...
Exhaust
NO drone... wife will kill me.... As I understand it, I'll see the biggest performance benefit from changing the downpipes. I would probably stick with something catted due to state emissions inspections and noise reduction. If just changing the downpipes, will there be a noticeable increase in cabin noise? Are there any other things I should consider downstream of that that will benefit performance, but not make the car noisy?
Non-performance
What are the other recommended upgrades, either in support of the above, or just for general drivability? I understand this engine suffers from carbon buildup like our 335d, so was considering adding the catch can. Are any of you additionally blocking off the EGR as they do on the diesels to prevent the buildup in the first place? My car just received a walnut blasting before delivery, so I'd like to maintain a level of clean if at all possible... Diverter valves, Rob Beck PCV valves, are these necessary upgrades when doing any of the above? Anything else I should consider.
Thanks all, looking forward to joining the e61 community!
Tune
The options in running are: 1) Burger JB4, 2) Cobb, 3) BimmerBoost/MHD flash, 4) Burger JB4 + backend flash.
Since I don't have a PC or Android device, Cobb seems the easiest plug-and-play. JB4 is a little cheaper, has some cool features, but I don't think I'd use them (no E85 near me, I don't use valet, I don't race...) I think the only time I would change map is if I were to upgrade bolt-on components. Power wise JB4 + a backend flash seems to be the best route, but between not needing the features of the JB4, and not having a device to flash myself this option seems extraneous for the added benefits. That said, if there's a compelling argument, I can pick up a cheap laptop.
Intake/Filter
Options are: 1) Drop in filter, 2) dual-cone intake, 3) some dual-cone intake with the shroud (like the AFE.)
This car will be used for long trips, so I don't want a lot of WOOOOSH... I assume a drop in filter is the quietest option? Will that still yield a performance gain that a tune can take advantage of, or do I really need to remove the stock airbox? While doing this I would consider changing the charge pipe as well. Will I see a performance benefit from that? Intercooler will probably be done at some point...
Exhaust
NO drone... wife will kill me.... As I understand it, I'll see the biggest performance benefit from changing the downpipes. I would probably stick with something catted due to state emissions inspections and noise reduction. If just changing the downpipes, will there be a noticeable increase in cabin noise? Are there any other things I should consider downstream of that that will benefit performance, but not make the car noisy?
Non-performance
What are the other recommended upgrades, either in support of the above, or just for general drivability? I understand this engine suffers from carbon buildup like our 335d, so was considering adding the catch can. Are any of you additionally blocking off the EGR as they do on the diesels to prevent the buildup in the first place? My car just received a walnut blasting before delivery, so I'd like to maintain a level of clean if at all possible... Diverter valves, Rob Beck PCV valves, are these necessary upgrades when doing any of the above? Anything else I should consider.
Thanks all, looking forward to joining the e61 community!
03-17-2016, 07:06 AM
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My Ride: 2008 535xi
Model Year: 2008
Engine: n54
Sounds to me the tune part.. cobb is more pricey compared to the JB4.. but the price difference can get you a laptop. I haven't been in a cobb tuned N54 so I can't say it's better or worse.. but ease of use vs install vs price is really your call. MHD is cheapest since you just need to buy a device and a cable and a tune, so that would even undercut price of all.. but you'd have to learn how to do it yourself.
As for intake, the car is so sound proofed I WISH it had a more of a whoosh sound, but none of the above made a difference unless I'm in a parking garage or tunnel with the windows down
Exhaust is all up to you, it's pricey to upgrade.. and downpipes are the biggest gain. I have an XI model, so that's even more of a pain.. so I didn't bother. I have an axle back which to me is nice, it droned more upon install but after a few months to me it doesn't drone at all and I wish it were louder on most occasions except starting it up at 6am I wouldn't want to bother neighbors.. but really.. it's not that loud.
To me, the sports mode hidden button mod helped my throttle response a ton, which I love. Driving manual I am not sure how much of an increase it is since I have never driven a manual version. That in itself is basically free except for your own labor
Catch can is a nice thing for longer term reliability.. and diverter valves is a zero performance gain as with the charge pipe since you're already not planning on going for wild. The cost benefit factor to me is none especially since you want it quiet. Still.. my previous point is that the car is really quiet anyways so the only time you'd hear it is wide open throttle shifting and letting off.
As for intake, the car is so sound proofed I WISH it had a more of a whoosh sound, but none of the above made a difference unless I'm in a parking garage or tunnel with the windows down
Exhaust is all up to you, it's pricey to upgrade.. and downpipes are the biggest gain. I have an XI model, so that's even more of a pain.. so I didn't bother. I have an axle back which to me is nice, it droned more upon install but after a few months to me it doesn't drone at all and I wish it were louder on most occasions except starting it up at 6am I wouldn't want to bother neighbors.. but really.. it's not that loud.
To me, the sports mode hidden button mod helped my throttle response a ton, which I love. Driving manual I am not sure how much of an increase it is since I have never driven a manual version. That in itself is basically free except for your own labor
Catch can is a nice thing for longer term reliability.. and diverter valves is a zero performance gain as with the charge pipe since you're already not planning on going for wild. The cost benefit factor to me is none especially since you want it quiet. Still.. my previous point is that the car is really quiet anyways so the only time you'd hear it is wide open throttle shifting and letting off.
03-18-2016, 03:45 AM
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Thanks you for the reply. Yeah, the jury is still out on whether to go JB4, Cobb, or Bimmerboost/MHD (which I grouped together because the difference is really in the upload hardware, either which I would have to buy.)
Good to know about the intake, that opens up some possibilities!
What exactly are the downpipe options for the XI? One I found said "fitting" is needed, and in digging deeper required extensive cutting and re-welding of the new pipes… Not looking to do that.
I wonder if the hidden sport mode is comparable to the sport mode that was on my E46 M3. That basically gave the car more throttle body opening with less pedal input. That car was a manual as well, and honestly I never used it because I just ended up slipping the clutch during shifts since the sweet spot was then moved... Still might be fun to do since it's free!
Sounds like a catch can is good insurance, thanks for your feedback!
Good to know about the intake, that opens up some possibilities!
What exactly are the downpipe options for the XI? One I found said "fitting" is needed, and in digging deeper required extensive cutting and re-welding of the new pipes… Not looking to do that.
I wonder if the hidden sport mode is comparable to the sport mode that was on my E46 M3. That basically gave the car more throttle body opening with less pedal input. That car was a manual as well, and honestly I never used it because I just ended up slipping the clutch during shifts since the sweet spot was then moved... Still might be fun to do since it's free!
Sounds like a catch can is good insurance, thanks for your feedback!
03-18-2016, 05:25 AM
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My Ride: 2010, E61, 535i xDrive
Model Year: 2010
First, congratulations on the E61, it is beautiful!
I have dual cone intake, and I can now hear my turbos spooling at WOT...however, it is not a huge amount of noise, wife has never noticed them (perhaps because I hardly ever do WOT with her). But that would be your best option.
Tune, MHD is still your best and lowest cost option, even after adding the cost of a cheap Android device (you can get one at Best Buy for ~$80 bucks). I had Procede piggy back and liked it, then switched to MHD and love it! I get more linear acceleration response. I am also getting great mileage, 19 MPG in the city (never getting on the freeway) @ 29 MPH avg. I can get up to 31 on the highway @ 60 MPH, or 25 MPG @ 80 MPH.
Exhaust, if you're looking at down pipes, the only bolt on option are AR Designs, the other lower cost option requires cutting and welding (as you previously mentioned). I don't know much about the increased sound because I haven't done it yet, I'm still thinking about it...wife is the limitation, just like you ;-)
I recently put a catch can as well, good insurance. Remember to put new spark plugs at the time of doing a tune, and keep changing them every 20k miles.
How many miles do you have in your E61?
BTW, you should've posted this in the E61 section ;-)
I have dual cone intake, and I can now hear my turbos spooling at WOT...however, it is not a huge amount of noise, wife has never noticed them (perhaps because I hardly ever do WOT with her). But that would be your best option.
Tune, MHD is still your best and lowest cost option, even after adding the cost of a cheap Android device (you can get one at Best Buy for ~$80 bucks). I had Procede piggy back and liked it, then switched to MHD and love it! I get more linear acceleration response. I am also getting great mileage, 19 MPG in the city (never getting on the freeway) @ 29 MPH avg. I can get up to 31 on the highway @ 60 MPH, or 25 MPG @ 80 MPH.
Exhaust, if you're looking at down pipes, the only bolt on option are AR Designs, the other lower cost option requires cutting and welding (as you previously mentioned). I don't know much about the increased sound because I haven't done it yet, I'm still thinking about it...wife is the limitation, just like you ;-)
I recently put a catch can as well, good insurance. Remember to put new spark plugs at the time of doing a tune, and keep changing them every 20k miles.
How many miles do you have in your E61?
BTW, you should've posted this in the E61 section ;-)
03-18-2016, 08:34 AM
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My Ride: 2010 535i xdrive
Model Year: 2010
Congrats on the E61 Manual pick-up! Great find. I have a 2010 535i xdrive manual so I can share some of my experiences with you.
Tune - I went with the Cobb v2. The reason was I wanted more power but I am not turning this into a race car or logging anything. I wanted something simple that added power. You just plug it in, it downloads your current map and then uploads a Cobb map. My 5 year old can do it.
The reason I stayed away from JB 4 was because that is like hacking into your DME, and I did read a few people frying their DME, and since I am not an expert tuner and wanted to keep things simple I opted for Cobb. MHD was not available at the time, but that is the new tuning software for people getting heavily into maximizing their cars potential.
You can pick up a used v2 Cobb for like $200-$250 these days. No reason to get a V3, it only has bells and whistles that you probably will not use.
Intake - After looking a long time I ended keeping the stock air box. I thought about getting the Injen intake but paying $300 for something that will have minimal impact was not worth it. The other options are to throw on some of the Burger DCI's or a drop-in filter. Burger DCI's are for maximizing power, which I don't think you are trying to do, so a drop-in filter may be all you need, but I doubt it will do anything noticeable.
Exhaust - I have a couple friends running the AR DP's and they love them. You can feel the power difference. Also look at adding the RB turbo inlets. I kept my exhaust the same, thought about adding the Eisenman Sport exhaust as that sounded the best to me on the youtube videos I watched. Their race exhaust was too loud.
Non-performance - Get a walnut blast/intake valve cleaning and then add the Oil Catch Can. Keep up with maintenance as well, the engine runs hot. If you change spark plugs you may want to think about also changing your ignition coils because the tune will reduce their life expectancy.
Tune - I went with the Cobb v2. The reason was I wanted more power but I am not turning this into a race car or logging anything. I wanted something simple that added power. You just plug it in, it downloads your current map and then uploads a Cobb map. My 5 year old can do it.
The reason I stayed away from JB 4 was because that is like hacking into your DME, and I did read a few people frying their DME, and since I am not an expert tuner and wanted to keep things simple I opted for Cobb. MHD was not available at the time, but that is the new tuning software for people getting heavily into maximizing their cars potential.
You can pick up a used v2 Cobb for like $200-$250 these days. No reason to get a V3, it only has bells and whistles that you probably will not use.
Intake - After looking a long time I ended keeping the stock air box. I thought about getting the Injen intake but paying $300 for something that will have minimal impact was not worth it. The other options are to throw on some of the Burger DCI's or a drop-in filter. Burger DCI's are for maximizing power, which I don't think you are trying to do, so a drop-in filter may be all you need, but I doubt it will do anything noticeable.
Exhaust - I have a couple friends running the AR DP's and they love them. You can feel the power difference. Also look at adding the RB turbo inlets. I kept my exhaust the same, thought about adding the Eisenman Sport exhaust as that sounded the best to me on the youtube videos I watched. Their race exhaust was too loud.
Non-performance - Get a walnut blast/intake valve cleaning and then add the Oil Catch Can. Keep up with maintenance as well, the engine runs hot. If you change spark plugs you may want to think about also changing your ignition coils because the tune will reduce their life expectancy.
03-18-2016, 11:14 AM
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My Ride: 2008 535xi
Model Year: 2008
Engine: n54
Wow that's some awesome gas mileage! I can only get 19.5mpg.. I admit that in the morning commute to work it's mostly high speed freeway, but at night it's always traffic, which is why I *think* that's a good number. Before a lot of my mods I got 24mpg, but that was stock, drive mode and really being nice. Now I drive with my sport mode all the time, and any good moment to accelerate I'll take it!
I started to look into MHD back end.. but to me it's more for using E85. Maybe you can tell me how much different the mapping is/can be for JB4 for gas mileage.. in my experience it just is the nature of the car and driving conditions.. so there's only so much you can boost it.
Yes there are really ZERO options for the XI downpipes.. when looking at VSRF? you really have to dent/hammer out the one part of the exhaust that I would hardly call it minor modification.
The sports mode button also increases steering stiffness... but I've never really experienced bad throttle response from any manual transmission.. so it's possible to make it even more sensitive I would say.
I started to look into MHD back end.. but to me it's more for using E85. Maybe you can tell me how much different the mapping is/can be for JB4 for gas mileage.. in my experience it just is the nature of the car and driving conditions.. so there's only so much you can boost it.
Yes there are really ZERO options for the XI downpipes.. when looking at VSRF? you really have to dent/hammer out the one part of the exhaust that I would hardly call it minor modification.
The sports mode button also increases steering stiffness... but I've never really experienced bad throttle response from any manual transmission.. so it's possible to make it even more sensitive I would say.
03-22-2016, 12:46 PM
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Thanks guys. I'm going to give the BMS DCIs a try since they're cheap, don't sound like they'll be overly loud, and I was ordering a catch can anyway. Also found out the wife had a android tablet not being used at work, so I'm "borrowing" it to give MHD a shot. The car got a walnut blast from the dealer before I bought along with new injectors.
03-22-2016, 04:52 PM
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My Ride: 2010 535xiT M Package
Congrats on the new car. I have a Cobb and other goodies for sale. I will post them up in the next day or so as I'm working to get the parts off the car
03-23-2016, 09:54 PM
#9
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MHD tune, Ultra racing strut bars. M5 brakes up front are direct bolt ons.
I wouldn't bother with an intake, the stock airbox works just fine.
AR Design went bankrupt so the Downpipes will have to be obtained 2nd hand.
I wouldn't bother with an intake, the stock airbox works just fine.
AR Design went bankrupt so the Downpipes will have to be obtained 2nd hand.
03-28-2016, 08:27 AM
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My Ride: 2010 535 xi - M Sport Pkg & other goodies
wow, hadn't heard the news about AR Design. Surprised as they were known as the highest quality downpipes. any links to the news or discussions?
Last edited by Lotus99; 03-28-2016 at 08:41 AM.