Upgrading Logic7 Speakers/Amps
03-13-2006, 03:05 PM
#11
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Open up my Infinity amp from the bottom panel, I found circuits is mounted upside down. What I did was remove bottom panel and mount it upside down with 1/2 inch airgap. This is sufficient enough for hot air diffuse out of the amplifier.
I agree with you if I did not open up the bottom cover and leave 1/2 inch gap.
I agree with you if I did not open up the bottom cover and leave 1/2 inch gap.
03-13-2006, 03:10 PM
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That might be fine.... since this probably isn't a high-current amp anyway.
Does the amp have any internal cooling fans? Those would help out, too.
Does the amp have any internal cooling fans? Those would help out, too.
03-13-2006, 03:40 PM
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Originally Posted by subterFUSE' post='254426' date='Mar 13 2006, 06:51 PM
Its good that the high-end stuff is out of your pricerange.... because if you keep the factory headunit, you don't need to be spending money on super-good speakers, amps, etc...
Like I said.... chain.... weakest link.... yada yada yada.
You put Dynaudios in the E60, and run them with the factory source unit.... that would be a joke. It's like buying an M5 with the speed limiter set at 50 mph. You'll never come close to its potential.
The same would be true of McIntosh amps. It's overkill if you keep the factory source unit.
In fact, even in a competition setup.... most people don't think the Dynaudios sound very good. This is because Dynaudios are about the most acoustically neutral car speaker made in the world. So they sound different because they don't color the sound. They take about 1000 hours just to break-in. You can even get a special CD from them just for the break-in period. Most people are used to listening to garbage speakers and they have grown accustomed to the colored sound.... so when they hear a neutral speaker for the first time, they don't like it.
Like I said.... chain.... weakest link.... yada yada yada.
You put Dynaudios in the E60, and run them with the factory source unit.... that would be a joke. It's like buying an M5 with the speed limiter set at 50 mph. You'll never come close to its potential.
The same would be true of McIntosh amps. It's overkill if you keep the factory source unit.
In fact, even in a competition setup.... most people don't think the Dynaudios sound very good. This is because Dynaudios are about the most acoustically neutral car speaker made in the world. So they sound different because they don't color the sound. They take about 1000 hours just to break-in. You can even get a special CD from them just for the break-in period. Most people are used to listening to garbage speakers and they have grown accustomed to the colored sound.... so when they hear a neutral speaker for the first time, they don't like it.
Hes exactly right and no one could have said it any better. Its gonna be pretty hard to go super clean audio setup in an E60 without dropping a huge wallet.
I personally dont think its wise to use good high end components on a factory setup. It really doesnt make sense. Some subs wouldnt really matter but as far as forking over 600 for some MBs or something hooked up to an amp from an a/v converter, thats a waste.
03-13-2006, 06:09 PM
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I may have missed the point on EuroCarFan's question, but I thought that it was about improving his sound system without going insane. I totally agree with subterFuse's weekest link theory, however, in the case of the E60, the weekest link is not the head unit, it's the amps and speakers. If EuroCarFan takes the output signal from the head unit pre-amp and runs it into a new amp with new speakers he will get better quality, which is what he was after. Once again don't get me wrong though, I know the factory head unit isn't God's gift to car audio and an aftermarket unit would definitely take it to school, but it's not the weekest link, upgrading can be done.
Also, in terms of speakers, MB Quarts and Focals aren't going to give you the insane competition sound that you guys are talking about, they're going to give you quality sound that has a very large frequency range. Not to mention they are some of the few manufacturer's that actually make quality 4" speakers that will fit the E60. I don't think he's looking for SPL Competition sound out of his system, he's looking for improvement which can and has been done. I don't know, maybe I'm wrong, I don't want to make anyone upset or anything, those are just my thoughts on his question.
Also, in terms of speakers, MB Quarts and Focals aren't going to give you the insane competition sound that you guys are talking about, they're going to give you quality sound that has a very large frequency range. Not to mention they are some of the few manufacturer's that actually make quality 4" speakers that will fit the E60. I don't think he's looking for SPL Competition sound out of his system, he's looking for improvement which can and has been done. I don't know, maybe I'm wrong, I don't want to make anyone upset or anything, those are just my thoughts on his question.
03-13-2006, 08:28 PM
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Hi guys,
I guess could have been clearer in my original post but Heiss5 is right. I don't want to revamp the whole factory system. I actually love the Logic7 as-is but was just thinking of possibly upgrading some of the components in hopes of getting a bit better sound. I agree with Subterfuse and the rest of you but I'm not after a competition sound system.
Bottom line is if you all think I can improve on the factory sound without changing the factory head unit.
I guess could have been clearer in my original post but Heiss5 is right. I don't want to revamp the whole factory system. I actually love the Logic7 as-is but was just thinking of possibly upgrading some of the components in hopes of getting a bit better sound. I agree with Subterfuse and the rest of you but I'm not after a competition sound system.
Bottom line is if you all think I can improve on the factory sound without changing the factory head unit.
03-13-2006, 10:13 PM
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Originally Posted by EuroCarFan' post='254527' date='Mar 13 2006, 09:28 PM
Hi guys,
I guess could have been clearer in my original post but Heiss5 is right. I don't want to revamp the whole factory system. I actually love the Logic7 as-is but was just thinking of possibly upgrading some of the components in hopes of getting a bit better sound. I agree with Subterfuse and the rest of you but I'm not after a competition sound system.
Bottom line is if you all think I can improve on the factory sound without changing the factory head unit.
I guess could have been clearer in my original post but Heiss5 is right. I don't want to revamp the whole factory system. I actually love the Logic7 as-is but was just thinking of possibly upgrading some of the components in hopes of getting a bit better sound. I agree with Subterfuse and the rest of you but I'm not after a competition sound system.
Bottom line is if you all think I can improve on the factory sound without changing the factory head unit.
I say yes. I love the way my setup sounds, and I love the fact that I can still use all my factory controls. But seriously though, we're just going to keep going back and forth on this topic all day because it's a personal thing, everyone has their own taste in music. I'd recommend going to a stereo shop and feeling around a bit, see what they might recommend and what you think sounds good. They have a solution for everything (some more costly that others) but that's why you go, check it out, weigh your options, and then decide if it's worth it.
My530i is right about the complexities of 7.2 channel stereo though, but you might be able to get away with a 5 channel amp and a 4 channel amp, where 2 of the 5 channels go to your subs and the rest go to your speakers. Not sure if this would work, just a thought, I'd check out the store though.
03-14-2006, 04:19 AM
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however, in the case of the E60, the weekest link is not the head unit, it's the amps and speakers.
You misunderstand my point. The point is not that the weakest link in the whole Logic7 system is the headunit.... it is that If you changed out the factory amp, and speakers.... but kept the factory headunit.... what would be the weakest link then? It would certainly be the headunit. I guess the wiring would be a sore point, too. But component-wise... the headunit would be it.
See what I'm talking about? It makes no sense to buy top-tier stereo equipment like Dynaudio or McIntosh if you are going to retain any of the OEM system. You would be handicapping your expensive gear if you did.
Maybe getting some MB Quart speakers might be fine, as they are not on the same level as Dynaudio.... certainly not the 4", at least. But the post I responded to was mentioning McIntosh.... which.... honestly.... is serious overkill.
03-14-2006, 05:50 AM
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my530i; (or anyone else that wants to chime in....) being a total noob in this department...can i just take out the regular speakers and replace them with the MB Quarts and the Earthquake sub and thats it?
im not looking for more power or an audiophile setup, just some more detail in the speakers and a little tighter base than the factory setup.
also if adding the mb quarts; do they replace the tweeters in the window corners too, or just the mids?
im not looking for more power or an audiophile setup, just some more detail in the speakers and a little tighter base than the factory setup.
also if adding the mb quarts; do they replace the tweeters in the window corners too, or just the mids?
03-14-2006, 09:37 AM
#20
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I was trying as you did and I was disappointed. I first bought just a pair of MB Quart RVF-210 4" component speakers (4"mid + 3/4" tweater), and replaced rear left speaker and tweeter with new speakers. Turn on the radio and I was disappointed on the sound output level which was very weak compare to OEM ones on the right. One thing to remember is OEM can handle from somewhere 20W to 50W RMS for mid/high channel. This is an educated guess because the same speaker and tweater are used for L7 sound system, which drive 40W to each 4"mid+1"tweater pair, and 25W for US standard sound system.
This MB Quart can handle from somewhere of 40W to 90W, so OEM system does not drive MB Quart RVF-210 to its potential. That was why it was not as loud as OEM one driven by OEM headunit.
Same for the sub. OEM US std system is only 40W and it's too weak to drive my new Earthquake 150W RMS/300W max SWS-8 8" shallow mount subwoofer.
In short, I need to find an amp that has RMS output power match with speaker and sub RMS power handling.
Here are the break down:
6 channel Infinity amp is quite perfect match for US std system because 4ch are for midrange and above, and 2 ch are for low freq.
I use those 4ch to drive front and rear speakers, and last 2ch to drive 2subs under seat.
The painful part is wiring. I had to take out front woodtrip, MAS-K, driver footwell, driver front seat, rear seat+back rest, rear panels, etc. Looks like I took the car a part. Thanks to Rudy for his geneous information on removing stuffs.
Mounting amp in the trunk on the floor will cause a lot of noise because of thick power wire is nearby the rear seat. To make it quite, mount it on the rear panel in the trunk. This will eleminate the noise significantly.
Also, to avoid noise from picking up along the line, use twisted speaker wire will cancel the noise which BMW use for speaker wires.
For the rear, speakers can be easily replaced. For the front, front door panels must be taken out to access mid and tweaters. One thing to take note is when ripping out the front door panel, don't rush and seperate door panel out for more than 5 inches from its original location or you'd break airbag wires and door handle night light wires.
Let me know if you have any more question.
Plan ahead and prepare for full 24 hours of work if this is for very first time to taking your car apart.
This MB Quart can handle from somewhere of 40W to 90W, so OEM system does not drive MB Quart RVF-210 to its potential. That was why it was not as loud as OEM one driven by OEM headunit.
Same for the sub. OEM US std system is only 40W and it's too weak to drive my new Earthquake 150W RMS/300W max SWS-8 8" shallow mount subwoofer.
In short, I need to find an amp that has RMS output power match with speaker and sub RMS power handling.
Here are the break down:
6 channel Infinity amp is quite perfect match for US std system because 4ch are for midrange and above, and 2 ch are for low freq.
I use those 4ch to drive front and rear speakers, and last 2ch to drive 2subs under seat.
The painful part is wiring. I had to take out front woodtrip, MAS-K, driver footwell, driver front seat, rear seat+back rest, rear panels, etc. Looks like I took the car a part. Thanks to Rudy for his geneous information on removing stuffs.
Mounting amp in the trunk on the floor will cause a lot of noise because of thick power wire is nearby the rear seat. To make it quite, mount it on the rear panel in the trunk. This will eleminate the noise significantly.
Also, to avoid noise from picking up along the line, use twisted speaker wire will cancel the noise which BMW use for speaker wires.
For the rear, speakers can be easily replaced. For the front, front door panels must be taken out to access mid and tweaters. One thing to take note is when ripping out the front door panel, don't rush and seperate door panel out for more than 5 inches from its original location or you'd break airbag wires and door handle night light wires.
Let me know if you have any more question.
Plan ahead and prepare for full 24 hours of work if this is for very first time to taking your car apart.