AFE CAI Refund...
10-27-2008, 08:45 PM
#21
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Hi Guys,
I am here to address the refund policy. Paul said he will refund what I paid for the kits, but when I got a email back from him he said he will only issue me a "STORE" credit which is WORTHLESS to me since I haven't pushed their products since this whole issue started. I was more than willing to issue a refund minus the shipping & credit card fees, but a store credit would not help me. If Paul @ AFE decides to credit my bank account or credit card then I will be more than happy to issue the refund, but at this moment I won't be able to refund any kits as I would go under...I hope everyone understands my point of view on this. Please feel free to answer back on this thread or PM me or email me. Thank you.
I am here to address the refund policy. Paul said he will refund what I paid for the kits, but when I got a email back from him he said he will only issue me a "STORE" credit which is WORTHLESS to me since I haven't pushed their products since this whole issue started. I was more than willing to issue a refund minus the shipping & credit card fees, but a store credit would not help me. If Paul @ AFE decides to credit my bank account or credit card then I will be more than happy to issue the refund, but at this moment I won't be able to refund any kits as I would go under...I hope everyone understands my point of view on this. Please feel free to answer back on this thread or PM me or email me. Thank you.
10-27-2008, 11:37 PM
#23
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I don't understand how this is our problem? As the buyers, we should not be the ones taking the loss, we demand a full refund, this is our hard earned money on the line, if you can understand. thank you.
10-28-2008, 06:37 AM
#25
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Reply #3 (I am passing him all the posts bothering him).... And he replies!
I have given the calculations showing that their 30" Peterson fan generates a best 28 mph wind and only if the fan is up against the grille. Under the conditions that were shown on the youtube video, where there was an 8' distance between the fan and the front grille, the breeze hitting the front grille would be more like 7-10 mph. A simple way to confirm this would be to place your hand in front of the grille next time a dyno test like this is done and compare how the "wind" feels to when you stick your hand out the window when the car is traveling at 70 mph. You will feel a big difference.
When you taking into consideration that the "breeze" from the 30" Peterson fan is likely to be a low 7-10 mph, you will have a negative impact on the performance of even a "heat-shielded" intake system with the hood closed because of the lack of air circulation in the engine compartment. You are no longer testing the vehicle in "real driving" conditions. What BMW owner would be interested in performance gains at 7-10.
If one basic foundation of an argument is shown to be suspect, then you would have to be suspicious of the other aspects of their argument. Where is the comparison with our intake system and their scoop? If their scoop works with a stock intake system, should it not work with a shielded intake system. Eloy's argument that ram effect won't work on a conical filter is incorrect. The face velocity of a 7-10 mph breeze hitting a flat panel stock filter will be no different in the face velocity of the same breeze hitting a conical filter. The dyno data that RPI only shows the detrimental effect of engine heat being absorb by our intake system in a "atypical" driving condition for a BMW of 7-10 mph. Note the difference in IAT.
You should also ask RPI why dyno data is not shown with their scoop on a totally stock filter and stock intake system with the hydrocarbon trap filter element in place. They only show with the K&N filter. Why is that? Did they by chance remove the hydrocarbon trap filter element? If you remove the hydrocarbon trap filter element, you should see a gain of 7 to 8 hp on the dyno. The reason I ask is that one of the local BMW owners who had their vehicle tested at RPI said that the HCA was removed.
RPI is not a threat to us. They don't make intake systems. However we will be a serious threat to them since we now make scoops as well as intake systems. RPI will never get a patent on their scoops as the design is not unique. Even their claim for "patented" scoops is false unless they can provide a patent number. They can claim it's "patent pending" if they in fact has filed for a patent. RPI will struggle to sell if they don't show that their scoops results in gains. We do not need to put down RPI to sell our products. That is why I don't participate in the forums because the questions I've raised here will be viewed with skepticism by RPI "friends".
Paul
I have given the calculations showing that their 30" Peterson fan generates a best 28 mph wind and only if the fan is up against the grille. Under the conditions that were shown on the youtube video, where there was an 8' distance between the fan and the front grille, the breeze hitting the front grille would be more like 7-10 mph. A simple way to confirm this would be to place your hand in front of the grille next time a dyno test like this is done and compare how the "wind" feels to when you stick your hand out the window when the car is traveling at 70 mph. You will feel a big difference.
When you taking into consideration that the "breeze" from the 30" Peterson fan is likely to be a low 7-10 mph, you will have a negative impact on the performance of even a "heat-shielded" intake system with the hood closed because of the lack of air circulation in the engine compartment. You are no longer testing the vehicle in "real driving" conditions. What BMW owner would be interested in performance gains at 7-10.
If one basic foundation of an argument is shown to be suspect, then you would have to be suspicious of the other aspects of their argument. Where is the comparison with our intake system and their scoop? If their scoop works with a stock intake system, should it not work with a shielded intake system. Eloy's argument that ram effect won't work on a conical filter is incorrect. The face velocity of a 7-10 mph breeze hitting a flat panel stock filter will be no different in the face velocity of the same breeze hitting a conical filter. The dyno data that RPI only shows the detrimental effect of engine heat being absorb by our intake system in a "atypical" driving condition for a BMW of 7-10 mph. Note the difference in IAT.
You should also ask RPI why dyno data is not shown with their scoop on a totally stock filter and stock intake system with the hydrocarbon trap filter element in place. They only show with the K&N filter. Why is that? Did they by chance remove the hydrocarbon trap filter element? If you remove the hydrocarbon trap filter element, you should see a gain of 7 to 8 hp on the dyno. The reason I ask is that one of the local BMW owners who had their vehicle tested at RPI said that the HCA was removed.
RPI is not a threat to us. They don't make intake systems. However we will be a serious threat to them since we now make scoops as well as intake systems. RPI will never get a patent on their scoops as the design is not unique. Even their claim for "patented" scoops is false unless they can provide a patent number. They can claim it's "patent pending" if they in fact has filed for a patent. RPI will struggle to sell if they don't show that their scoops results in gains. We do not need to put down RPI to sell our products. That is why I don't participate in the forums because the questions I've raised here will be viewed with skepticism by RPI "friends".
Paul
10-28-2008, 06:41 AM
#26
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I do not think we should be asking Trinity for the refund if they are only going to be receiving store credit and they discontinued selling AFE products. They sold us the product with what AFE was marketing, not what Trinity has marketed. I think we have to bug AFE about this situation and I do not think that Trinity is at fault, but that if just my opinion. I have sent an email to AFE, but they have not responded yet. I will post it here if they do respond.
10-28-2008, 07:22 AM
#27
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Originally Posted by houbmw' post='705331' date='Oct 28 2008, 07:41 AM
I do not think we should be asking Trinity for the refund if they are only going to be receiving store credit and they discontinued selling AFE products. They sold us the product with what AFE was marketing, not what Trinity has marketed. I think we have to bug AFE about this situation and I do not think that Trinity is at fault, but that if just my opinion. I have sent an email to AFE, but they have not responded yet. I will post it here if they do respond.
i say this with all due respect to Joe, Weez and Team Trinity - but when you become a distributor for a company and begin to sell their product, you essentially represent the company. If for some reason aFe has an issue with their product, the end consumer goes goes to where? The vendor/store they purchased it from! For instance, when a toy from Hasbro is recalled - you, the end consumer, return it directly to where you purchased it from - not from the manafacturer.
10-28-2008, 08:00 AM
#28
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Originally Posted by MacFly' post='705373' date='Oct 28 2008, 10:22 AM
i totally disagree.
i say this with all due respect to Joe, Weez and Team Trinity - but when you become a distributor for a company and begin to sell their product, you essentially represent the company. If for some reason aFe has an issue with their product, the end consumer goes goes to where? The vendor/store they purchased it from! For instance, when a toy from Hasbro is recalled - you, the end consumer, return it directly to where you purchased it from - not from the manafacturer.
i say this with all due respect to Joe, Weez and Team Trinity - but when you become a distributor for a company and begin to sell their product, you essentially represent the company. If for some reason aFe has an issue with their product, the end consumer goes goes to where? The vendor/store they purchased it from! For instance, when a toy from Hasbro is recalled - you, the end consumer, return it directly to where you purchased it from - not from the manafacturer.
With all my dealings with Trinity, Nerwyll and Joe have been very professional.
Customer service has been top-notch. I only expect the same in this situation.
Guys, I know you'll come through for this.
10-28-2008, 08:15 AM
#29
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Originally Posted by MacFly' post='705373' date='Oct 28 2008, 11:22 AM
i totally disagree.
i say this with all due respect to Joe, Weez and Team Trinity - but when you become a distributor for a company and begin to sell their product, you essentially represent the company. If for some reason aFe has an issue with their product, the end consumer goes goes to where? The vendor/store they purchased it from! For instance, when a toy from Hasbro is recalled - you, the end consumer, return it directly to where you purchased it from - not from the manafacturer.
i say this with all due respect to Joe, Weez and Team Trinity - but when you become a distributor for a company and begin to sell their product, you essentially represent the company. If for some reason aFe has an issue with their product, the end consumer goes goes to where? The vendor/store they purchased it from! For instance, when a toy from Hasbro is recalled - you, the end consumer, return it directly to where you purchased it from - not from the manafacturer.
But we should not all lean on Trinity to get this done. We need to do it as a group. Its a sizable group since many of us here have bought the aFe CAI. Should we get a list together for this effort?
10-28-2008, 08:25 AM
#30
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Originally Posted by theXman' post='705416' date='Oct 28 2008, 12:15 PM
+1 Very good point.
But we should not all lean on Trinity to get this done. We need to do it as a group. Its a sizable group since many of us here have bought the aFe CAI. Should we get a list together for this effort?
But we should not all lean on Trinity to get this done. We need to do it as a group. Its a sizable group since many of us here have bought the aFe CAI. Should we get a list together for this effort?
1.theXman
2.khooger