Ginkler

Rudy,

I've seen a lot of posts from you about the advantages of the SMG vs. manual transmission and a LOT of other people negative on the whole issue. I'm looking at buying a 2007 M5 with 21K mi fully loaded and the two I've found are only different in the transmission choice. The manual is a CPO but the SMG is not, when the warranty runs out in 2010 what are long-term maintenance costs for this transmission. I hate automatics specifically because they break and are expensive to fix.

Money is not an issue for gas on a car like this but a $14K tranny repair is. I love the idea behind the SMG and I imagine if not abused it can work very well for a long time. With a slightly used car I have to assume they drove the snot out of it and hope any problems will surface durring the warranty period. Any advice ya'll can bring to the table is great, I've owned bothing but american V-8s my whole life so this will be my first try with an immigrant.

Finally, I apoloigize to all the men in this forum but this car is for my woman to drive every day. She has no experience with a manual (not that it's very difficult) but I wonder what your opinion of the learning curve might be for someone not used to normal clutching/shifting? Anyone else please throw in your $.02, I'm going to need it for GAS!!!

Thanks,
Ginkler

Westcoast M5

The car is expensive to fix so I see it as 3 options:
(1) Trade it in when the warranty is up
(2) Buy an extended warranty to take you past 2010
(3) Accept that there could be some big repair bills.

If you keep the car long enough, like any car, eventually the powertrain will need to be rebuilt or replaced....but in this case it will be expensive. How long really depends and how many miles you put on it, how hard you drive it and a bit of luck.

If your wife or g/f will drive the car everyday have her test both and see what she prefers. SMG or 6 spd, if you don't drive it right you will smoke the clutch no question. Good luck!

pennetta

The M5 with a manual six speed was never a great performer, the SMG is the way to go. The SMG will be expensive to repair and the people able to work on it will be far and few between. The hydraulics have been the real issue and I had my SMG replaced because of it (under warranty).
The actual transmission hardware seems to be robust and maybe it won't cost $14k to fix.

skylolow

When I bought mine (before I bought it) I talked to a Service agent about long term outlook on SMG. He really had nothing to say negative about it. He said there was some issues intially as with any new product. But all issues have been worked out with software updates. He said a few trannys had some issues but nothing more or less then if your buying a manual or auto.. He said he knew people who tracked there M3's and M5's with SMG and never have they ran into any problems. Basically made it sound like a few days at the track is years worth of normal driving as far as wear and tear goes. In the end it was his reccomendation that realiablity should not really be a factor in choosing SMG, Auto, or Manual. He did say though that if you do have a major internal issue with SMG the whole tranny usually gets replaced. Where as a manual you could have the option of a rebuild. But as with most BMW's you should always have a warranty on them for most there life. Mainly for the fact that the people that can fix these cars usually charge top dollar for labor and it adds up quick.


P.S.: Like what the other poster said the M5 really shines with the SMG from what I've read around the net.

545felix

actually, with BMW manual trannys, there is no rebuild. the only option is a replacement. so really you're in the same boat. get the CPO or a matching aftermarket warranty that covers the SMG. there are virtually no replacement parts for either.

formuleuno

I was talking to my BMW salesguy and there were 3 M5s that are sitting on his lot. They are ALL the SMG ones. From what he's seen, the people who bought the manual ones usually keep them.

mhs525

M cars are a handful as daily drivers unless you don't deal with much traffic. I had an M3 for 18 months, awesome car, still miss it but it wasn't the best car to drag myself home in after a long day. A long test drive in all conditions is in order before buying and M car. You really can take M cars on a race track and go nuts...

In terms of warranty to me that is a must have. E60's are VERY complicated and highly technical and the M5 is another step up... I wouldn't keep my 545i W/O a warranty never mind and M5. Lots of M5's get dumped and take a huge depreciation hit when the warranty runs out.

My .02

Rudy

Ginkler, first of all, welcome to the best source of information for the E60 on the net!

As far as your question(s), I wish I had a crystal ball to be able to answer things thoroughly but as far as long-term reliability for the SMG goes, I don't think there's enough hard data to support any real conclusions. My praise of the SMG that you've read here is more about the concept and advanced nature of the technology. Early on, there were many debates about what was "better" an SMG or a traditional manual (or, as I like to call them, "old-fashioned" manuals!) Again, early on, when there were very few SMG cars available to test drive, there were people who were resistant to change and felt that with an SMG, you gave up some control over what an old-fashioned manual offered. In addition, many people who found an SMG car to test drive did not come away with a favorable opinion of it because they weren't able to adjust to the differences between what they were used to and this completely new way of driving a manual transmission during a short, limited test drive (remember, they're both manuals!) To make matters worse, many salespeople weren't able to fully explain the concepts behind the SMG and in many cases, they steered people away from them to try and keep people from buying something they might not like. (Even at my dealership, I heard "Are you sure you want the SMG?" more than once before placing my order -- in my case, I was absolutely sure and never regretted it!)

Most of my praise here (and on other forums) was basically to try and help people understand that SMG can be a great choice but only after you open your mind and allow yourself to re-learn or change some driving habits. Unfortunately, there are more BMW customers out there who don't read these forums, etc. and ended up purchasing the SMG for the wrong reasons. The people who bought an SMG instead of a manual so that the wife/girlfriend could drive it in automatic mode were quickly disappointed. Many of those cars were bought back by dealers to attempt to keep customers happy. When there are an abundance of SMG M5s on the pre-owned lot, immediately people assume that SMG sucks. In my opinion, these cars may simply be casualties of what I described above.

Again, I didn't own my SMG beyond my warranty period but during the time I owned it, it performed very well but then again, I never abused it or did anything to it that would cause any excess wear and tear. (Also keep in mind that the SMG on the non-M cars is entirely different than the one on the M cars.)

Just to prove my point about how great SMG is in the right hands, allow SMG owners here some time to post their experiences. I think you'll quickly see that there are many more SMG lovers than there are SMG haters -- but beware of the SMG haters who never actually owned one! It's the actual SMG owners that know best. If they sucked, they'd complain about it but since they don't suck, they are generally very happy with them...

ctsang1234

I abosuletely love my SMG, the other half won't drive my car, but that's not my problem. I do think the next BMW will be a manual, but until then, I'm driving my SMG like there is now tomorrow...

Westcoast M5

Further to Rudy's comments, it's really hard to get a feel for the SMG from a short test drive. You will get the idea of how it works from a test drive, but you need to drive it for a month or so to really learn how to drive. It's a bit of a leap of faith but as Rudy points out, most people that have them love them. I sure do.

Just make sure your wife takes it for a good test drive. An M5 is a lot of car and it's personality is not for everyone.