Mmmm... McDonald's.

I think I'll go get breakfast there this morning.

 

We'll set Doug up as our diplomat...

 

Doug- I lived in the UK for a year. Agree on most of your points. Different standard of living entirely. Although living in Manhattan now I sometimes miss the relative tranquility of London! As for the technology gap between Europe and the US, I used to be in the cellular industry and more recently was in the cable business. The main reason cell phones and other niche technologies are more 'advanced' in Europe is simply because the US infrastructure came first, since we invented most of these technologies. So here in the US we spent a lot of cash building out version 1.0 of everything while they were using tin cans with strings. By the time we were done, they started their buildout with Version 2.0 (which we probably had a hand in inventing anyway). So they got GSM networks (which by the way are inferior to CDMA but are far more widespread) and PAL TV resolution which is better than our NTSC. The good news is now that we are up to Version 3.0 of everything (3G, 3rd Generation, etc) the US will soon retake that technology lead. Take HDTV for example, which blows away anything in Europe, where they are content with their PAL standard. And the cable and satelite TV in Europe is simply awful compared to what we have here now in digital cable and DirecTV.

Anyway, total digression for a BMW board. But seemed appropriate.

Thanks Doug.

 

China has almost no wired telephones. 12-13 years ago I used to travel to China a lot. Back then, a Cell phone was a luxury for an average person in America. I used to laugh when I saw a Chinese guy driving a donkey pulled cart wearing a suit talking on a cell phone. China skipped wired phones and went straight to mobile since wiring was so expensive. Now, everybody in China has a cellphone, but canot get wired cable tv or internet.

 

"Doug", interesting that other than one reference to "cool" no one had really mentioned Europe or made any comparison between technology in Europe and here in the US when you felt compelled to take this otherwise interesting thread totally off topic, and with such devastating use of unsupported generalizations presented as fact. I think we agree that the US can be a wonderful place to live. And so can Europe. And you know what? Some of our European friends actually do appear to be able to afford to BMW's!! Despite those tax rates!! And I'm sure some of them - can you believe this!! - perhaps don't live in apartments with 10 ft square yards. And some of them even have the temerity to have internet access (though perhaps it is through tin cans and string as another poster here appears to suggest) so they can post here!!!!

 

Please, go to Europe and go to a BMW dealer. Talk to some regular people in restaurants like I do. Talk to people you do business with, like I do. That is how I learned about these topics. And I started this rant becuase somebody in this thread made a backhanded slam at America as the home of Fast Food and Walmart. I should have just ignored that, I am sorry, but sometimes on these forums it is easy to just go off more than you would if you were speaking face to face with somebody. I apologize.

I have been in Europe for about 1/4 of my life for the last 5 years, and Yes I do know what I am talking about. BMW would not offer a 545 if it were not for the USA and the Middle East Market. Yes a BMW does cost twice as much in Europe as it does in America. Yes gas is 5 Euro a gallon. No Europeans do not make twice as much a year as Americans. Yes there are fat lazy people in Europe just like in America. Yes MacDoanlds and Burger King's largest grwoing Market is in Europe. Europe has Walmart and also Carrefour (sic) which is a dumpy French version of Walmarts. No it is not common for Germans or any Europeans to live in a single family free standing home, while it is common in the USA. No a regular middle class guy in Europe does not drive a BMW let alone a 5 series; most likely a 3 series diesel if they can afford that. Yes America is more violent, I acknowledge that, so in that way Europe is nicer. They do have high taxes in Europe and high levels of benefits for people that do not work, hence the 8% to 15 % unemployment.

So, I did make a lot of generalized statements, but all are based on facts and not just my biased opinion. IF you ran my list by an average Dutch or German, they would agree and not be offended, I am sure.

I will try not to go off on tangents on this page anymore. Sorry if I offended anybody, but lately America takes a lot of criticism from the European media and so called "Eliteists" , and also from Americans that went to Europe for vacation last summer and had a nice time and somehow think it is a better place to live than here. I may of been guilty of the same offense when I was younger and first went to Europe and got excite about it becuase it was fun and different from America.

Once again, sorry; no offense to anybody except perhaps to Lazy unemployed people that collect benefits. (Sorry, I do not know when to shut up)

-Doug

 

Understand where you are coming from, I've perhaps seen a different side of Europe than you, but fair play to you for acknowledging the generalizations (and to be honest we all do that when it suits) so let's agree to disagree and move on.

 

WTF.

I really hate sweeping generalisations... so in the interest of not making one... and as background before I have my say -

I like Americans and have many American Friends. I draw no comparisons between UK and USA apart from it is the only other country in the world I would consider settling in.. Of course because I like seasonal climate change I would live in New England!

But

How in the name of sanity did Doug get the Internet? Irony is not your strong point Doug. I think you'll find that Wiszmaster was being I R O N I C ..

You appear to think that somehow the "cool stuff" you refer to is financed by the fact that socialism exists in Europe... how exactly does that happen.. By osmosis or maybe by brainwashing.. So not by the companies that invent, patent, manufacture and sell the technology then.. and apparently all European socialist countries have 8-15% unemployment .. ??? 5 minutes searching the Internet for Euro political and social demographics will give you the correct statistics..

I agree we pay a lot for gasoline

A 525i with no options is not 65,000 euros it lists at 27,925gbp or 39,941euros which at today?s exchange is 53,790usd.. yes probably more than in the USA.

A lot of people drive company cars or take allowances.. it is called a perk.. it is also usually a choice thing.. in fact one I chose this time..

McDonalds and BK are not on every street corner thankfully.

We do have European equiv.?s of hillbilly's and rednecks

Apparently not everybody in Germany shops at Aldi... and in the UK we do not have to rush to the shops because they shut at 20:00 in fact we can shop 24hours 6 days a week + 12 hours on Sunday at the 3 big UK supermarket chains in person .. or we can order our groceries online and have them delivered between 06:00 and 23:00 7 days a week.. far more civilised than actually having to waste your own life performing menial tasks I feel...

The phrase "Most Northern Europeans live in Apartment blocks and have no yard, so they buy or rent a small plot of land in a park full of little shacks and that 10 ft by to foot piece of land is where they go on Sunday to drink beer and tend to the garden" is the nonsense rants of a person who has probably only been to a small area of Europe.. In the Uk we have a mix of housing styles... very few are wooden construction or have wheels...

Your standard of living is "remarkable" as is your freedom - Maybe yours personally.. but from your right wing stance on the unemployed I can only assume that you have no social conscience and raise the Klingon shield of invisibility also known as a blind eye to the poor in the USA.. may I recommend a trip to downtown Philadelphia, Nashville, Jacksonville, San Francisco, Detroit and Miami.. all of which are cities that I have witnessed staggering poverty and depravation in.

For the rest of you who sprang up in what can only be some form of mass hysteria -

We have Walmart, they bought up a uk chain called Asda.. but they don't sell guns over the counter..

You build out v1.0 of everything whilst we were using tin cans and string.. Is that everything v1.0 or every American thing v1.0 ? Believe it or not you do not actually invent everything.....

Yes the US have invented some "cool" stuff.. so have Europe and Asia .. all that "chest puffing" we are on 3g etc etc blah blah is nonsense.. to correct you we are on 3g, we have HDTV and digital satellite/cable .. I think you will find that is called every moving technology and global corporate development.. Anyhow most if it was probably invented in Asia..

As background

I am British, I live in Greater Manchester Uk but have worked in 4 states in the USA ,(Delaware, Tennessee, Massachusetts, Pennsylvania), In the far east I have worked in Singapore and Japan, and closer to home in, what from Doug's rant appears to be the 3rd world, Europe I have lived and worked in Holland, Italy and of Course Britain... I have a social conscience and do not care if I live under a socialist or conservative regime as long as the standards of healthcare, education, public services, and welfare for the needy and justice are high.

I, like many of what doug thinks are my European Peasant companions, can afford BMW's. I have have owned 7 from new my first being a '93 325i coupe to what is listed in my signature. I have also owned an XJ8 jag and when I was based in the US my company leased me initially a Lincoln Navigator SUV which I hated, and then by my choice, a Range Rover HSE which was also pretty crap.

I choose to live in the UK because like most people no matter where I travel I am pre-programmed to like where I was born and from where I have adapted to the socio economic dynamics.

Footnote -
Ps How come you have 14 posts but still haven't quite mastered the registering bit.. too technical 4 ya obviously registartion v1.0 is a European programme... ho ho
Oh b4 i forget the average German or Dutch person woudl probably give a far more pesonal reponse than mine, after all we British are reserved..

Sorry if the above should offend anyone, Doug can't help himself.

 

Well said

 

Well said.