E39 vs. E60
12-22-2006, 06:16 PM
#11
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My Ride: '04 545iS 6 spd, bought new via eBay, 11/05; Blk/Gry, Cold, L7, PDC, BMW Rear seatcover for pets.
First "Bumwa" was a new 1971 2002. High performance 5s since 1987. Beamer motorcycles too, currently on an 07 BMW K1200 GT; also a Moto Guzzi 1000 SP III.
For real-world driving, I preferred the lower-down power band of my 540iS, 6 spd. You could lug it around town without rowing all the time. Not sure on the handling, since new car has active steering (I'm still not sold on it), suspension and thumpflats.
However, ergonomically, I think the E60 is a disaster: cramped driver footwell that causes me to catch my foot on the deadpedal on the way down with the clutch, uncomfortable door armrest (hard), lousy rearward and lateral vision, zero body protection on doors or bumpers. OTOH, the E60 is much more wind-tight, even if it groans a lot.
Just some thoughts; got to 100,000 on E39 before trading it.
Ray Hull
However, ergonomically, I think the E60 is a disaster: cramped driver footwell that causes me to catch my foot on the deadpedal on the way down with the clutch, uncomfortable door armrest (hard), lousy rearward and lateral vision, zero body protection on doors or bumpers. OTOH, the E60 is much more wind-tight, even if it groans a lot.
Just some thoughts; got to 100,000 on E39 before trading it.
Ray Hull
12-22-2006, 11:59 PM
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My Ride: '05 545i - scheduled for ED pickup in Munich on 7/22!
Originally Posted by 550isport' post='370305' date='Dec 22 2006, 12:58 PM
BMW are you listening?
It is sad that a good number of posters, myself included, agree that the new 5s are actually less responsive than their predecessors. I am nearly certain that I will be adding the Dinan Koni suspension to my 550i sport just to get that old BMW feeling back. A BMW's comfort has traditionally come from supportive seats, a myriad of electronic amenities and a stiff solid chassis that is as close to rattle free as possible. I'm sure most repeat BMW buyers would agree that a floaty ride has no place in a BMW - and that is exactly what we have been offered by BMW since the introduction of the 745i in 2002. The M cars are exempt from this criticism, which makes sense inasmuch as M is a seperate entity. But it seems the new generation BMWs have been dulled a bit in the handling department in favor or a ride quality more widely acceptable by American standards. The new 7s, 6s, and 5s (all of which I have driven) handle better than the competition, but yet in an almost artificial way. In my experience most of the people who are 1) new to BMW; and 2) cross shopped other cars before buying either a 745/50, 645/50 or E60 5 - more often that not don't share the same philosophies and priorities as the tired-and-true E39, E38, E46 buyers. BMW must have decided to broaden its market share to steal some borderline Lexus/Mercedes/Jaguar buyers and frankly I think it has been to the detriment of its core values, and long standing customers. I say use the new technologies to broaden the performance envelope in equal measure to the comfort envelope. I think the new cars are a bit too soft (E90 exlcuded, I have had a 06' 325i loaner for 2 weeks and its a blast! I call it the BMW litmus test. Those that don't like driving it, don't like BMW - unfortunately I fear quite a few buyers new to BMW, who love their 5s, 6s and 7s are in that category)
Happy holidays,
DRP
It is sad that a good number of posters, myself included, agree that the new 5s are actually less responsive than their predecessors. I am nearly certain that I will be adding the Dinan Koni suspension to my 550i sport just to get that old BMW feeling back. A BMW's comfort has traditionally come from supportive seats, a myriad of electronic amenities and a stiff solid chassis that is as close to rattle free as possible. I'm sure most repeat BMW buyers would agree that a floaty ride has no place in a BMW - and that is exactly what we have been offered by BMW since the introduction of the 745i in 2002. The M cars are exempt from this criticism, which makes sense inasmuch as M is a seperate entity. But it seems the new generation BMWs have been dulled a bit in the handling department in favor or a ride quality more widely acceptable by American standards. The new 7s, 6s, and 5s (all of which I have driven) handle better than the competition, but yet in an almost artificial way. In my experience most of the people who are 1) new to BMW; and 2) cross shopped other cars before buying either a 745/50, 645/50 or E60 5 - more often that not don't share the same philosophies and priorities as the tired-and-true E39, E38, E46 buyers. BMW must have decided to broaden its market share to steal some borderline Lexus/Mercedes/Jaguar buyers and frankly I think it has been to the detriment of its core values, and long standing customers. I say use the new technologies to broaden the performance envelope in equal measure to the comfort envelope. I think the new cars are a bit too soft (E90 exlcuded, I have had a 06' 325i loaner for 2 weeks and its a blast! I call it the BMW litmus test. Those that don't like driving it, don't like BMW - unfortunately I fear quite a few buyers new to BMW, who love their 5s, 6s and 7s are in that category)
Happy holidays,
DRP
as for the original question, i didn't own an e39 but i've heard from many ppl that it felt sportier and more solid at high speed than e60.
12-23-2006, 02:11 AM
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My Ride: E61 535d Apr 05. UK spec + Media Pack, Luxury Pack & Visibility Pack
Originally Posted by Rudy' post='370289' date='Dec 22 2006, 04:19 PM
I had two E39's (both 540i with sport package) and drove them daily for a period of six years. In my opinion, the E60 (545i with sport package) handles much better -- not that the E39 handled poorly...
I don't know if it's the active roll, active steering, bigger rubber, or a combination of those and more but to me, the E60 is an improvement over the E39.
I don't know if it's the active roll, active steering, bigger rubber, or a combination of those and more but to me, the E60 is an improvement over the E39.
12-23-2006, 06:48 AM
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Interesting observations from E60 owners.
I was considering a used 2003 540i Sport but I figured the 545i must be better (cars don't usually get worse).
2 questions:
1) Are 540i's reliable?
2) Are the 540's sport seats better than the 545i's, or would one want comfort seats?
I was considering a used 2003 540i Sport but I figured the 545i must be better (cars don't usually get worse).
2 questions:
1) Are 540i's reliable?
2) Are the 540's sport seats better than the 545i's, or would one want comfort seats?
12-23-2006, 07:43 AM
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My Ride: 2008 Silverstone II E60 M5 2012 E70 AW X5 50i Sport w/ LCI Aero Kit and Rocker Panels
I loved my '03 E39 530i Sport better when it came to handling. I also liked the looks and the lines of the E39 more. The E60 is a great car and has many more "bells and whistles", when compared to the E39, but the E39 will probably always be one of my favorite cars of all time.
12-23-2006, 08:10 AM
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My Ride: 2007 BMW 550, Sport, Navi, PS, CWP, Sirius
Originally Posted by LowOrbit' post='370519' date='Dec 23 2006, 10:48 AM
Interesting observations from E60 owners.
I was considering a used 2003 540i Sport but I figured the 545i must be better (cars don't usually get worse).
2 questions:
1) Are 540i's reliable?
2) Are the 540's sport seats better than the 545i's, or would one want comfort seats?
I was considering a used 2003 540i Sport but I figured the 545i must be better (cars don't usually get worse).
2 questions:
1) Are 540i's reliable?
2) Are the 540's sport seats better than the 545i's, or would one want comfort seats?
1. Yes for 2003. Except for know problems (radiator, thermostat)
2. 540 sport seats are much, much, much better that 545 sport seats. Between 540 sport seats and 545 comfort seats it is a tie. I personally would still pick 540 seats but I am a small guy.
3. Overall 545 is much better car than 540. Some people may disagree but it is probably just the age thing.
12-23-2006, 09:18 AM
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My Ride: '05 545 Alpine White, Sport, CWP, L7, Nav. HUD
74 Lotus Europa
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I had a 03 540isport 6spd and never found a comfortable seating position for long drives. As long as I wasn't in the car over an hour it was great. The seats are much firmer than my 05 545i with sport package. After many miles in each car I feel that after you learn what the car likes the e60 is a better handling car that I could drive much harder than the e39.
12-23-2006, 11:46 AM
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Originally Posted by aosman' post='370262' date='Dec 22 2006, 09:40 AM
For those folks who owned (or drove) the E39 and the E60. How do they compare to each other when it comes to handling? Does the E39 handles better? Does it feel better at high speeds? (80+ MPH).
I know that the weight distribution on the E60 is better due to the extensive use of aluminum in the front but I keep reading occasionally that the E39 handled better than the E60. Some reviewers and writers say that the E39 had a "soul". Does the E60 have a "soul"? What the heck does that mean anyway?
I am a first time (and relatively new) BMW owner/driver with my 545 E60. When I bought this car, I also considered getting a certified pre-owned 2003 540. At the end I decided to go for the E60 because of the looks, the extra legroom and the iDrive.
I know that the weight distribution on the E60 is better due to the extensive use of aluminum in the front but I keep reading occasionally that the E39 handled better than the E60. Some reviewers and writers say that the E39 had a "soul". Does the E60 have a "soul"? What the heck does that mean anyway?
I am a first time (and relatively new) BMW owner/driver with my 545 E60. When I bought this car, I also considered getting a certified pre-owned 2003 540. At the end I decided to go for the E60 because of the looks, the extra legroom and the iDrive.
12-23-2006, 08:28 PM
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My Ride: 2008 535i: June 6th start build, complete June 17th, at NY Port July 5th, at dealer July 10th, took delivery Friday July 13- Plantimum Bronze/Natural Brown Leather/Light Poplar, Sport Package, Sport Auto, Active Steering, Premium Package, CWP & PDC. Dinan Performance Software 384hp & 421 ft/lbs.
The E60 is faster, handles better and has more trunk and rear seat room. I have the dynamic drive and active steering options which are light years ahead of my previous two E39's. Both models have souls, they are just a little different from one another.
