DSC affecting manual clutch take-up
05-26-2005, 07:25 AM
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This might already be documented somewhere, but I noticed something this morning. On my way to work, I decided to disengage DSC and DTC after getting the blinking light on an upshift.
To my surprise, disabling this assistance had two effects, one expected and one not. As expected, the effects of applying the throttle during "spirited" shifting were more pronounced and not subject to the artificial limiters. What I did not expect to discover was that disabling DSC/DTC also changed the way the car behaved in normal, leisurely, standing starts and shifts to higher gears at low RPMs with very little throttle.
This surprised me - I had previously always felt like I was fighting something (I thought it was my learned behavior) and struggling to operate the car smoothly, but with DSC and DTC disabled, my ingrained behavior is somehow perfect. Takeup is smooth and linear from standing starts, as is the takeup after engaging the next gear.
Has anyone else encountered this?
To my surprise, disabling this assistance had two effects, one expected and one not. As expected, the effects of applying the throttle during "spirited" shifting were more pronounced and not subject to the artificial limiters. What I did not expect to discover was that disabling DSC/DTC also changed the way the car behaved in normal, leisurely, standing starts and shifts to higher gears at low RPMs with very little throttle.
This surprised me - I had previously always felt like I was fighting something (I thought it was my learned behavior) and struggling to operate the car smoothly, but with DSC and DTC disabled, my ingrained behavior is somehow perfect. Takeup is smooth and linear from standing starts, as is the takeup after engaging the next gear.
Has anyone else encountered this?
05-26-2005, 07:40 AM
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I'll give it a try over this weekend (only time I get to drive)
05-26-2005, 12:32 PM
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My Ride: E60 530d Sport - Carbon Black, Black Dakota Leather, Media Pack (satnav, bluetooth, CD changer), heated font seats, through load
Interesting. What is different?
05-26-2005, 12:49 PM
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My Ride: 2004 545i - 6 speed manual (July 04 build), silver-grey/black, sports package std equipment (18", active roll, active steering, adaptive headlights), premium sound, bluetooth enabled, folding rear seat, lumbar, 3m hood/bumper protective film, rear tint, euro reflectors.
Originally Posted by Mercy' date='May 26 2005, 07:40 AM
I'll give it a try over this weekend (only time I get to drive)
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I will try taking the DSC/DTC off. The only time I take it off is when I am going to hammer on the car and then of course it is noticable - no violant jerks at hard starts or the 1st to 2nd shift.
05-26-2005, 03:00 PM
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Originally Posted by jsal' date='May 26 2005, 03:49 PM
[quote name='Mercy' date='May 26 2005, 07:40 AM']I'll give it a try over this weekend (only time I get to drive)
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[/quote]Right, that was my intention, but I also noticed that I was much smoother during all my regular starts and shifts. Too many for it to be anomalous.
05-26-2005, 03:45 PM
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My Ride: 2004 545i - 6 speed manual (July 04 build), silver-grey/black, sports package std equipment (18", active roll, active steering, adaptive headlights), premium sound, bluetooth enabled, folding rear seat, lumbar, 3m hood/bumper protective film, rear tint, euro reflectors.
Right, that was my intention, but I also noticed that I was much smoother during all my regular starts and shifts. Too many for it to be anomalous.
I will start paying attention to it tonight.
I wish you could turn of DTC without disabling DSC. I like the DSC for that what-if situation, but really don't have a use for DTC unless it is raining.
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[/quote]I will start paying attention to it tonight.
I wish you could turn of DTC without disabling DSC. I like the DSC for that what-if situation, but really don't have a use for DTC unless it is raining.
05-26-2005, 05:42 PM
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My Ride: 2004 545i 6 spd Sports Package | NAV | PDC | Logic 7 | BT retrofit | SW V13.3
Drove home after reading your post. I found no difference in shifting with DSC off. No difference in acceleration either. In hard driving you can of course chirp the tires in shifts and oversteer without having the engine die on you, which is what happens when DSC is on. With my newer tires it is really hard to notice much change in normal driving. With my worn tires the DSC light came on more regularly as I would loose traction. I do have a modified CDV, although I doubt that makes a difference.
05-26-2005, 05:42 PM
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My Ride: Now Driving a Freakin' Prius!
Was...
2004 545i | SMG | White/Black | Sport | NAV | Logic 7 | PDC | Fold-down Seats | Adaptive Headlights | Cold Weather Pkg | Clear-again Bra | Mud Flaps | Bluetooth | Coat Hangar | Aux Input | All Weather Mats | 18"X8.5" BBS RK w/ Michelin Pilot Alpin's (winter) | New steering rack @ 1.2K & 17K miles| Software V.19.1 | B&B Exhaust (vrrrroooooommm!) <---Click.
Don't know if this helps, but with my SMG I ALWAYS have the Sport button activated and mostly have at least the DTC off and often even have the DSC off as well. I don't like unanticipated vehicle interaction when I least expect it. My $0.02.
05-27-2005, 06:22 AM
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My Ride: 2010 550i M Sport Package - Alpine White/Blk Nasca Leather, Premium hi-fi system, Sat Radio, Nav, Cold Weather Package, Value Package, Shift Paddles, Comfort Access keyless entry, Power rear Sunshade, Front Ventilated seats, Split fold-down rear seats, Heated rear seats, Automatic high beams
jsal, I know about the CDV and I ordered one. I was going to replace myself one weekend when I also was going to change the oil (I like to do things myself).
I notice there were to many panels to remove (including the steel plate underneath the plastic covers) so I gave up. I need to make an appointment with those guys from NJ who provide the CDV.
Can't wait to get it done.
By the way can you share your experience with getting it removed by the shop and your take on how the clutch perfomed after.
I notice there were to many panels to remove (including the steel plate underneath the plastic covers) so I gave up. I need to make an appointment with those guys from NJ who provide the CDV.
Can't wait to get it done.
By the way can you share your experience with getting it removed by the shop and your take on how the clutch perfomed after.
05-27-2005, 07:48 AM
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Originally Posted by Mercy' date='May 27 2005, 09:22 AM
jsal, I know about the CDV and I ordered one. I was going to replace myself one weekend when I also was going to change the oil (I like to do things myself).
I notice there were to many panels to remove (including the steel plate underneath the plastic covers) so I gave up. I need to make an appointment with those guys from NJ who provide the CDV.
Can't wait to get it done.
By the way can you share your experience with getting it removed by the shop and your take on how the clutch perfomed after.
I notice there were to many panels to remove (including the steel plate underneath the plastic covers) so I gave up. I need to make an appointment with those guys from NJ who provide the CDV.
Can't wait to get it done.
By the way can you share your experience with getting it removed by the shop and your take on how the clutch perfomed after.
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Yes, I guess the CDV could be the important unknown. I have no idea if my car has one, whether or not an unmodified 545i with one would behave similarly or not, and the modified CDV 545i cars throw yet another wrinkle in...
I can say with certainty however after numerous "tests" that during normal leisurely driving either the throttle or the clutch is somehow easier to operate on my car. It's as if when DSC/DTC are enabled, the computer is retarding the throttle application or softening it, which might be a self-preservation measure for general longevity.
I notice it most during leisurely standing starts and 1st to 2nd shifts.