hhk31257

I have a 09/2004 525D E61
i originally had the business navigation with small screen.

i bought the navigation system on ebay which was used in another car.
the screen is VDO(same as the original) and the ccc is dated 07/2004

all i did was unplug the old ccc and put the plugs on the new ccc
modified the old LVDS cable to fit the new ccc and install the Idrive High controller
Everything is installed on the original car cables! (i did not install the navigation cable to the CAS yet, and the fan is not connected because i'm waiting for the wiring)
the system runs without any problems, i have image on the screen, can listen to the radio, navigation is not tested yet as the ccc doesn't want to read my copied 2009 map disk.

i took the car to the dealer yesterday for a complete programmation but i just received the news that there are a bunch of errors and the programming software quits
the errors apparently are that there are several strange unknown units in the system, which is the CCC, the screen and something else (maybe the ipod interface is also installed?).
the dealer says he tried to do a retrofit via retrofit path from business to pro with progman and also tried to switch from m-ask to ccc in another menu but both options came up with errors and progman quits

does anyone have any idea whats going wrong and how to fix it? thanks!

Dr Dave

very common fault mate, its because you are trying to program a retro fit and that will not work with secondhand parts that are already "coded" it can be done quite easly but you need to go about it differently. (ie not as per progman) or you will need to put in all your old bits and get it updated first, then program for retro fit.
if you speak to mark at cartronics in byfleet surrey, he will tell you how to go about it.
it is documented here on dirks retro fit post somewhare and mark explained how to...just spend some time using the search function.

good luck.

hhk31257

so it is the car computer and not the ccc that is outdated? and the older software on that car computer cant handle new second hand parts?
so if i put the old stuff back in and get the "new" software on the car computer and then install the second hand parts the "new" software will be able to recognize the second hand parts because that is how it is programmed in the "new" software?

so the new versions of the car software are updated so that it recognizes these second hand parts?

am i getting this right? (sorry for going on about this but i want to be sure that it will work, they are asking about 250? for reprogramming and i dont want to buy thin air this time)

Dr Dave

yes..

you can program it as it is but you must follow the instructions in the post i was refering to otherwise
put your car back to how it was, then get it updated with all faults cleared, then you can put in the new stuff and get it coded as a retro fit, its long winded i know but thats how it is, i would get someone with autologic to retro code it personally. quicker/cheaper and you wont have to put the old stuff back in again.

your call mate, but give mark a call to answer any of your doubts.

hhk31257

thanks for all the info mate!
yet another question though (i'm trying to find out how the system works)
-software of the car
-software of the ccc

if progman cannot update the software of the car because it doesn't recognize the software of the ccc then what is the benefit of the autologic coding? just to get the ccc to work?
and if i do it the progman way (putting back the old parts) the newer software on the car computer will be able to recognize the new ccc anyway?
this would mean that bmw changed the software of the car to allow these kinds of devices to be accessed?

what i'm actually after is knowing if this way i will get everything to work together (in case i need a car software update any time later)
or do i simply get the coding for the ccc done so that the ccc works?
if i only get the ccc to work but not recognized by the car then i'm still nowhere because if i need to get the car coded i will have the same problem all over...

any thoughts on this?
i'm gonna give mark a call for sure.

Dr Dave

anytime you get ANYTHING added or retrofitted, you will need to get it coded even if you get the latest upgrade, the "car" needs to know what bits you have added and to allow the control of those bits to work with every thing else, im afraid its a side effect of the complicated E60 electronics.

hhk31257

yes i do understand that, what i wonder is if progman cannot recognize the new devices with the old car software then why should it recognize the the new devices with the new car software?
so the question is: is the new car software modified or updated to recognize these devices so that progman can program the car?
if the new software doesnt detect the devices either then nothing changes..., i do not need to get the ccc coded because everything already works, i simply want to get the car reprogrammed and the new devices installed because atm the dealer cant even install my ipod interface because it is connected behind the "unrecognized" ccc... the new ccc and screen works, i have navigation etc but coding anything else on it is not possible.. its basically a stand alone device atm

Dav530d

I have been told that part numbers are grouped. If yours is a 2003-sep2005 build date you need parts with simialr buld date. Same for sep2005 - 2007 and then 2007-. I have been told this by several independants.

545felix

it's far more complicated than you think.

If you're going through the dealer, the car and the dealer's computer (progman) have to be on the same version before you can do the upgrade. You have to take the car in with the old bits, update the car's version to the version the dealer has, clearing any errors at the same time. Then you take the car home, install the CCC and monitor, fan wiring harness, etc. (*EVERYTHING* has to be in place, otherwise the dealer's computer will not do the retrofit) and take the car back to perform the retrofit nav professional path. You will NOT be able to add anything else to the car until the CCC is coded to the car and the 609 code is added to the car's list of codes.

if you go the autologic route as Dave recommends, you don't have to worry about any of this crap, just remove the business nav code first (606 I think?) and then do the retrofit prof nav, like Dirk did.

hhk31257

so it has alot to do with progman being the same version as the software installed on the ccc.
great info mates!
i installed the old parts again (except the controler high) so the dealer can do the programmation tomorrow
i put all the parts back without attaching the screws etc so once the update is done he'll connect the new ccc and screen and then do the retrofit
i'm sure this thread can help other people as well to better understand how progman etc works

i'll update this as soon as i get my car back.