pinguhk

http://news.bbc.co.uk/sport1/hi/motorsport...one/6896888.stm

I hope he dose not loss point.
I am a big fan of Ferrari but this is out of order.
Farrari just what to get some points back :thumbsdown:

BetterMakeWay

If i were Ferrari right now, i would start my own private investigation of the case, and try to link the poor performance with the white powder and in the same time prove that Mclaren used that info or were going to use perfectly knowingly. I mean why would a sole person steel the files, study them, and then what start it's own F1 team?! I mean i am almost sure that it's impossible for neither of Coughan's superiors to not have knowledge about the existing Ferrari dossier.

Then i would sue Coughan under the criminal law, cuz i don't see any civil offense that Ferrari can claim.

And also if FIA is to punish Mclaren, i would assume it's fairly enough to disqualify them from the constructor's championship, but if they do that then...i assume it's impossible not to reflect into the drivers too. I mean for sure Ferrari will know how to put the problem, in the way that drivers get penalized also. They can claim in the court that if the car had any sort of advantage as to the stolen papers or Ferrari having a disadvantage then it implies that drivers also benefited from that advantage or Ferrari disadvantage and it's clear that they have to be penalized accordingly regardless the fact that they knew or not about the whole story.

Anyway...that's how i would play it.

Iceman

I can see that FIA punishes McLaren, but the drivers had nothing to do with it, and therefore it would not be fair to punish them.

JetBlack5OC

To impose a ban, the FIA would need to prove that Coughlan made use of the information he had either in accommodating Ferrari design features on the McLaren or in adapting McLaren strategy and procedures in light of what he knew about Ferrari's processes. Should that happen, Hamilton and Alonso could be thrown out of the world championship.

Simply having some people at McLaren knowing of the docs' existence does not give them sufficient grounds for expulsion. Sanctions, perhaps.

BetterMakeWay

Yes but would it be fair on the other hand to get the results (the drivers) from a unfair situation?
Reformulation: Would the Mclaren drivers have had the same performance if the car (suppose) wouldn't have had the advantage?

JetBlack5OC

Thats the thing, FIA would need to prove that Coughlan made use of the information he had either in accommodating Ferrari design features on the McLaren or in adapting McLaren strategy and procedures in light of what he knew about Ferrari's processes. That will be difficult to do and take some time.

Iceman

They can allready prove it.
There seems to be enough evidence, that's what you hear from "close" sources...

JetBlack5OC

Really, I quess time will tell. This is a shame, we were having such a great F1 season.

Centurion

Several things need to be sorted out in this mess...

The only solid evidence in this case is that a Ferrari dossier, filled with technical information, was found at Mike Coughlan's house.

I see this the same way as JetBlack. The court needs to understand exactly what the contents of this dossier is, how that information was to be used by Coughlan, and whether or not that information was actually utilized to give team McLaren an advantage over Ferrari.
The burden is on Ferrari to prove that McLaren changed their training, their equipment, improved their cars, etc. as a result of the technical information in Ferrari's dossier.

Assuming McLaren is guilty in this matter, the points earned by McLaren and it's drivers during the period the 'sensitive info' was passed-on upto the present may be taken away. For obvious reasons, any points earned before this should remain. The court will need to determine some important dates.

This is not going to be an easy case for Ferrari.

Iceman

Well informed inside sources say that FIA has all the prove.
Coughlan took advantage. He didn't copy the Ferrari's, but what he did were steps that were related to the dossier. Right after this they started dominating.
What other people, drivers etc., knew... nobody can prove. Therefore, they remain not guilty. And the drivers could have still thrown it away with mistakes on the circuits. So, it could be that the drivers don't lose points, but the team will.
However, there is no reason we need to discuss this any further, since this can go either way. Only God knows...
We all have to wait and then... wonder...