22s on a Ferrari
04-18-2007, 04:58 AM
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Originally Posted by PoleApart' post='415089' date='Apr 18 2007, 03:54 AM
I have the factory 16 inch wheels on my 328 and I have yet to see any that look better. People put 18 and 19 inch wheels on them and it just looks so wrong - like Sophia Loren in baggy jeans and back to front baseball cap. Mixing styles / fashions from different periods usually doesn't work especially when the original is pretty difficult to better.
Attachment 30956
Attachment 30956
i luv your baby, my fav growing up was the 308GTS and I luv the 328 as well...I dont care what anyone else says or thinks, Hamman or anyone else doesnt not squat!!!! Ferrari's are Ferrari's and require NOTHING further, 20"s or 22"s are not only foolish looking, they are absolutley WRONG!!! (JMHO 
) larger wheels equal POOR performance and handling, the complete opposite of the philosophy of the Prancing Horse
you dont buy a street legal race car and change the rims so you can pimp it out 
04-18-2007, 06:27 AM
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Originally Posted by m630' post='415160' date='Apr 18 2007, 03:58 PM
i luv your baby, my fav growing up was the 308GTS and I luv the 328 as well...I dont care what anyone else says or thinks, Hamman or anyone else doesnt not squat!!!! Ferrari's are Ferrari's and require NOTHING further, 20"s or 22"s are not only foolish looking, they are absolutley WRONG!!! (JMHO ) larger wheels equal POOR performance and handling, the complete opposite of the philosophy of the Prancing Horse
you dont buy a street legal race car and change the rims so you can pimp it out 
Larger wheel equal poor performance and handling?! How come? Is this your rule or who made it up?
04-18-2007, 06:50 AM
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That first picture of the 599 on 22's appears to be PS'ed. Look at the tires on the right-hand side of the car.
At any rate, it's ugly for sure. I mean, the color doesn't even match.
At any rate, it's ugly for sure. I mean, the color doesn't even match.
04-18-2007, 07:17 AM
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Originally Posted by Centurion' post='415190' date='Apr 18 2007, 05:50 PM
That first picture of the 599 on 22's appears to be PS'ed. Look at the tires on the right-hand side of the car.
At any rate, it's ugly for sure. I mean, the color doesn't even match.
At any rate, it's ugly for sure. I mean, the color doesn't even match.
04-18-2007, 07:27 AM
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Originally Posted by BetterMakeWay' post='415185' date='Apr 18 2007, 04:27 PM
huh? Larger wheel equal poor performance and handling?! How come? Is this your rule or who made it up?
Larger wheel equal poor performance and handling?! How come? Is this your rule or who made it up?
04-18-2007, 08:42 AM
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Originally Posted by PoleApart' post='415200' date='Apr 18 2007, 06:27 PM
Larger wheel generally equals larger weight - equals higher unsprung mass - equals worse handling.
And since we are talking about a Ferrari i really disagree about the fact that a person would put a bigger wheel, heavier than the stock one. For example if the F is on 19" standard which for sure are quite light rims because we are talking after all about a Ferrari, chances are that going to 20" or even 21" the outcome would be even lower weight since we assume the guy that owns a Ferrari has the money to pay a high-end rim. If not lighter maybe close to the original weight.
But even with this problem you didn't calculate the tire sidewall and tire width that comes into equation. Having a smaller tire sidewall improves the response of the wheel/steering, also it reduces the rubber flex in high demanding cornering. Also having wider tires results in almost all cases in more traction both in the straight line and in cornering--> better handling due to the larger contact patch.
04-18-2007, 08:58 AM
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Originally Posted by BetterMakeWay' post='415236' date='Apr 18 2007, 06:42 PM
Well said: generally.
And since we are talking about a Ferrari i really disagree about the fact that a person would put a bigger wheel, heavier than the stock one. For example if the F is on 19" standard which for sure are quite light rims because we are talking after all about a Ferrari, chances are that going to 20" or even 21" the outcome would be even lower weight since we assume the guy that owns a Ferrari has the money to pay a high-end rim. If not lighter maybe close to the original weight.
But even with this problem you didn't calculate the tire sidewall and tire width that comes into equation. Having a smaller tire sidewall improves the response of the wheel/steering, also it reduces the rubber flex in high demanding cornering. Also having wider tires results in almost all cases in more traction both in the straight line and in cornering--> better handling due to the larger contact patch.
And since we are talking about a Ferrari i really disagree about the fact that a person would put a bigger wheel, heavier than the stock one. For example if the F is on 19" standard which for sure are quite light rims because we are talking after all about a Ferrari, chances are that going to 20" or even 21" the outcome would be even lower weight since we assume the guy that owns a Ferrari has the money to pay a high-end rim. If not lighter maybe close to the original weight.
But even with this problem you didn't calculate the tire sidewall and tire width that comes into equation. Having a smaller tire sidewall improves the response of the wheel/steering, also it reduces the rubber flex in high demanding cornering. Also having wider tires results in almost all cases in more traction both in the straight line and in cornering--> better handling due to the larger contact patch.
I think you'll find that on a Ferrari the OEM 19 inchers are the ones optimised for low weight. The 20-22 aftermarket alloys people choose are usually optimised for bling.
Wider tyres = better roadholding not handling. Good handling is down to weight distribution, center of gravity, good inherent suspension design, proper alignment, tyre choice and tyre pressures. Most cases if you start messing with wheels you defer from the original offsets, you definitely need to play with tyre pressures and few places will be able to adjust alignment accordingly. Let's face it - those who swap wheels on Ferraris are not usually doing it for performance reasons.
Also in the real world a low profile, hard sidewall, wide tyre is going to be a bitch on rutted roads.
04-18-2007, 09:14 AM
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Originally Posted by PoleApart' post='415244' date='Apr 18 2007, 07:58 PM
Sure it's a general comment
I think you'll find that on a Ferrari the OEM 19 inchers are the ones optimised for low weight. The 20-22 aftermarket alloys people choose are usually optimised for bling.
Wider tyres = better roadholding not handling. Good handling is down to weight distribution, center of gravity, good inherent suspension design, proper alignment, tyre choice and tyre pressures. Most cases if you start messing with wheels you defer from the original offsets, you definitely need to play with tyre pressures and few places will be able to adjust alignment accordingly. Let's face it - those who swap wheels on Ferraris are not usually doing it for performance reasons.
Also in the real world a low profile, hard sidewall, wide tyre is going to be a bitch on rutted roads.
I think you'll find that on a Ferrari the OEM 19 inchers are the ones optimised for low weight. The 20-22 aftermarket alloys people choose are usually optimised for bling.
Wider tyres = better roadholding not handling. Good handling is down to weight distribution, center of gravity, good inherent suspension design, proper alignment, tyre choice and tyre pressures. Most cases if you start messing with wheels you defer from the original offsets, you definitely need to play with tyre pressures and few places will be able to adjust alignment accordingly. Let's face it - those who swap wheels on Ferraris are not usually doing it for performance reasons.
Also in the real world a low profile, hard sidewall, wide tyre is going to be a bitch on rutted roads.
Wider tires generally give more grip. Of course the handling of the car is the mix of all the elements you've just mentioned and so much more...but the point is that i assumed all things remained constant. Tuners like Hamann know what they are doing. Look at that black F430, lowered, properly alligned etc. Respectable tuners are carefull when they mess with bigger wheels, keeping close offsets, watching to keep the same diametere of the wheel etc etc. Pressure is not a valid point since each real DRIVER sets his pressure according to his driving style and taste, even in stock format.
Your last comment is true but also in real world a stock Ferrari is a bitch on rutted roads. So no news here. Buy an SUV for that.
04-18-2007, 03:44 PM
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larger rims definitely negatively affect acceleration as well as those issues mentioned about handling, just look at the lambo merc lp640 for example, the "stock" rims are 18"s 
why should anyone know better than they as to which rims perform better? ....Ferraris today are 18s and 19s, there are no reasons at all to go higher, thats just show stuff not real performance stuff.....and it doesnt matter what you spend, a larger wheel will always be heavy than a smaller wheel as both could be made out of any material for any price;
the race track has proven what the optimal rim size is for a ferrari or lambo or a bmw for that matter, and that size is what the car is delivered with; i have nothing against changing rims, but i just think the size should stay as optimized by the manufacturer when delivered
why should anyone know better than they as to which rims perform better? ....Ferraris today are 18s and 19s, there are no reasons at all to go higher, thats just show stuff not real performance stuff.....and it doesnt matter what you spend, a larger wheel will always be heavy than a smaller wheel as both could be made out of any material for any price;
the race track has proven what the optimal rim size is for a ferrari or lambo or a bmw for that matter, and that size is what the car is delivered with; i have nothing against changing rims, but i just think the size should stay as optimized by the manufacturer when delivered
04-19-2007, 04:30 AM
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Originally Posted by BetterMakeWay' post='415185' date='Apr 18 2007, 04:27 PM
huh? Larger wheel equal poor performance and handling?! How come? Is this your rule or who made it up?
Larger wheel equal poor performance and handling?! How come? Is this your rule or who made it up?dear Professors of drag and aerodynamics
wider tires (and not rimz) gives indeed better HANDLING! as you stick more to the ground so your overall handling is better, it matters mostly when you take high(er) speed curves/turning.
The straight acceleration by increasing the diam. of the wheel/rim may be reduced, also the weight in general grows.
But there are exceptions: I will report you more when my shoes are on. Now going from 17" RFT (or not really does not matter), with DD and sport suspension (not M sport). The car will be able to stay "on track" in curves at higher speeds as it will gain more traction, so theoretically in curves higher speed can be applied than before.
In straight I loose from the speed. However now it is remapped and will be dropped nicely for the twenties. Lower car further reduce drag, better groundforce.
The rims are 13,9 kg in overall lighter than before so summed up it will better or same and the LOOK you will see