Aviator

Here's my buddy's E39 M5 vs an E92 M3. The E39 pretty much beat the M3, but not by much. So, I figure the E60 M5 would easily handle it.

http://uk.youtube.com/watch?v=AD9NWg6HaGw

Rated M

[quote name='Aviator' date='Nov 29 2008, 01:30 PM' post='734349']
Here's my buddy's E39 M5 vs an E92 M3. The E39 pretty much beat the M3, but not by much. So, I figure the E60 M5 would easily handle it.[quote]

Took out an AW e92 M3 from Irvine BMW on Irvine Center Drive at two consecutive red lights from dead stop....pulling away in every gear. We got on the 405 north at ICD and once we hit the freeway...well, all I can say is that the new angel eyes on the e92 look pretty good, even in day light.

Jon M5

I did have a little race with an E92 M3 the other week. Both his car and my car are both stock. And..... he couldn't keep up for s**t!! We got up to around 145/150mph, and when i got there, he was a good 10 car lengths behind me. His was a manual 6 speed though, and mine's SMG, so i had the edge on gear change...

BetterMakeWay

i find it really funny how people compare the 335s and E39 M5s modded to stock M3s, and than brag about winning, and how the drivers of the M3s thought they could handle it. Well let me tell you something, not only it's not a fiar comparison but if i were the M3 driver that got beaten i would for sure end up with a smile on my face knowing the other people had to work on the engine to get the same or better results.

That being said why not you people compare your modded 335s and E39 M5s with an E92 M3 from AA (when it comes out s supercharger kit for it). Then start bragging, if you can! For stock car the M3 is undoubtedly the faster car!

Coming back to the thread discussion i would very much like to see how much the E60 M5 (stock) pulls away from an E92 M3 (preferable DCT) ---> that's the battle to be seen.

BetterMakeWay

Not only you had the edge on the gear change but you had the edge on gearing (7 speed vs 6 speed)

Plus if you'd race a M3 DCT from standing start i bet it would put one heck of a fight till 100mph or so. According to BMW the M3 DCT is 0.1 seconds quicker than the M5 to 100km/h.

John@Motorcepts

i would say the M5. The M3 has no torque whatsoever. Only reason I would buy the M3 is for the M. Rather get the 335i and mod it. Oh, beware that Queen Mary corgidog will say "Man that stuff sounds dangerous. I hope someone doesn't get killed while 2 kids try to figure out which car is faster."

BetterMakeWay

Sorry but what you say is nonsense!

First i would like to say that the M3 has almost the exact torque as the M5 only at a smaller scale.
The M5 is V10 and 5 liters and develops 520NM
The M3 is V8 (20% less) 4 liters (20% less) and 400 NM (23% less).

Considering the M3 is a full 140kgs lighter at low speeds that counts for smth. Plus it revs a tiny bit more so that means a tiny more "torque multiplier". Clickety click here for more info on the torque deliveries.

Bottom line is that imho one shouldn't disregard the M3 just because "has no torque whatsoever". On that basis the M5 also has no torque whatsoever. If i were you i would look at an AMG if you seek torque or a 535d puts down more torque even then the M5.

John@Motorcepts

fine. there is torque but nothing compared to the AMGs. I totally forgot that the M5 is low on torque as well. How come BMWs make high revving low torque engines???

BetterMakeWay

Because, as i explained in countless posts, you can't have both. There was a great article on the net which it seems i can't find it right now, which explained in detail the bmw high revving concept. There i also found the explanation for "torque multiplier" a characteristic of high revving engines that make use of the "mediocre" torque outputs but expand it on the whole rev range (which is bigger than on most cars like audi RS or AMGs)

too bad that from what i've heard BMW will dump the high revving concept of the M cars for the Turbo one. It's just a pity because we will not have screamer engines no more.Loosing that and we loose the history and the heritage AND i feel a part of the M soul. Hearing that engine scream at past 8000 rpm is music to any petrolhead. And to best check that go to porsche.com and listen to a 911 turbo engine vs a 911 GT3 engine. After that you'll understand which part of the soul i'm talking about.

PS: To further exemplify the high rev concept, i'll tell you that the M5 will have no problem in beating a 535d even from rolling starts. You may argue that well the M5 has almost double the 535d power but in truth, from rolling starts, it comes down to torque more than power. Power is just a derivative of torque. It's that sudden boost, that BAM that helps you on a roll on or on passing. Even though the 535d delivers more torque than the M5 it can only do it on short periods of time on a narrow RPM band. While the M5 will have almost double the RPM limit of the diesel at the disposal, the torque on the diesel will faint simply after 4000 rpm. So the sting of the diesel is almost twice shorter till the next gear change...and so goes on.

John@Motorcepts

def understand the 911 turbo. almost bought one b4 but held back....thank god i did from the market. BMWs always been into handling and AMG for overpowered monsters. cant rev high with torque. It's definitely a lot more fun to drive with a high revving monster. feels more of a sports car than driving a truck engine in a car.