shebuilt

I have owned many BMW's and honestly I haven't had one major issue with my high mileage BMW's. Most are over 200K miles and never needed anything major (well that darn water pump on my e38 750 almost killed me!!!!) but other than that - nada!

We have 9 in the family and they run like a 1967 slant Dodge Dart.

We don't pay all this money for poops guys! Our cars aren't built to last 100K and kill off! My mums 1993 525i td has 280K currently and she just keeps going and going!

Just wondering why all the flack behind cars with high mileage with regards to sells. Run them through the dealer checks first and put your mind at ease.

My opinion, I will run someone down for a high mileage M6 or X6 M for way less than average than to pay thousands more to have low miles.

Have a great weekend forum and happy cruising!

SilberGrauE60

Our cars, as well as many other durable consumer goods, are built differently today than in the past. Today, all kinds of corners are cut in terms of engineering and materials simply for cost reasons. That combined with all the high-tech features simply make our cars less reliable in the long run. That said, I intend on keeping my 545i for the long term. Prior to the 545i, I owned the last great M-B, a 140-series S320, for 13 years. The e60 545i is a great car, and I just hope it will remain great as it ages.

DD_545i

Well, you say that, but in a way they kind of are. Every component put in a car is built to a compromise. Take a drive shaft for example. You could build it out of solid titanium and make it 6 inches thick and it would last over a hundred years probably. That's way too over-engineered though. Instead they make it thinner than that, from a cheaper material, and will test it for a certain minimum life. I can imagine a 10 year minimum being a realistic goal for the designers. I can hear them saying we want it to last at least 10 years or 150,000 miles.

Other components, like suspension bushes are designed to be easily replaceable because it's known that they can't last forever. So when you're looking to buy a second hand car and you see one with 200,000 miles compared to one with 60,000 miles, you know right away that a certain number of components have seen a lot more action and are closer to their life's end. They may not have broken yet, but are close to it.

I do agree that our cars can go on well above 200,000 miles, but it will involve an amount of maintenance being expected.

I think it's a false economy to feel the need to buy a new car every 2 or 3 years for fear of some potential big maintenance jobs coming up. They're going to be much lower in cost than the depreciation costs involved in a new car. Buy a new one and you're looking at a 5 figure depreciation in value every year. Would you really spend that much in maintaining an 8 year old car? I doubt it. I've thought about buying an 850i a few times and people have said keep away, it's a money pit. That's probably due to stories of a 3 grand bill here, a 2 grand bill there. Yeah but the car costs peanuts these days.

I'm currently running my 2004 545i without a maintenance contract, because they wanted two grand a year for it. In the 15 months since I made that decision I've spent $0 on unplanned repairs.

pukka

The term "mileage" can be subjective depending on how its interpreted.

50k highway miles
25k city miles
10k drag/racing miles

Here you have three different mileage counts which would equate to three different prices for each assuming an identical car in each case. Yet an informed buyer would be biased toward one over the other two based on the type of miles driven.

I've always felt a better indicator for vehicle use would be "hours", but you won't find this readout on a car.


I've been working on and maintaining the cars that I've owned for almost 20 years. As long as a fix doesn't require removing the engine, welding, or bodywork I'm not afraid at all to do the work in my garage.

From my past experience, I feel its the electronic parts that fail more often - not the mechanical parts. The electronic parts are much more expensive to purchase and as a car gets older, the parts get more difficult to source. Furthermore, unless you pay for the software and interface you will almost have to go to a mechanic to get fault codes, data logging, and real-time data output values. Its for these reasons I'd be concerned about a "high mileage" or older car.

jm545i

I think the issue with today's cars is that while they will theoretically last a heck of a long time (and I plan on keeping mine for a while as well), they will inevitably end up costing a pretty penny to keep running optimally compared to the cars of yesteryear. An M30-engined 535i can easily go 250k or more miles without a bottom end overhaul, and our cars probably can as well.

BUT, an M30-engined 535i didn't have the dozens of sensors and other things that permit the higher compression ratios, fuel economy, and power delivery that current engines have, and could pretty much be kept going by oil changes, spark plug swaps, valve adjustments (manual), and maybe even a head gasket, but even a head gasket wouldn't involve the removal and re-installation of the uber-complicated valvetronic system and other support components that you wouldn't trust most mechanics to tackle. Maintaining all of those support systems as the cars age is inherently going to be more expensive.

On my car, I can live without the HUD, but do I want to? If I want to replace it after it goes bad I'll bet that's a $1,500 repair. I like my active cruise control, but replacing that radar unit is something like $1,000! The automatic HVAC system - I shudder to think what it would take to rip apart that dash.

The most annoying thing that would go wrong on an old 535i would be that the seat adjustment cables would get twisted up - something that could be solved with some tubing, skinned knuckles, and an afternoon! On the HVAC system all that went wrong was the fan resistor pack, which would make the fan only run on high. Replacing it took like a half hour.

shebuilt

In reading the responses thus far, I totally agree. I have to remember that my ranges are from a 1987 shark to the present 2007. I will say there is a huge difference in the engineering.

I also maintain my own vehicles and without my Bentley's or GT-1 I would probably be like the rest of my friends buying new cars every 5 years.

Yes the way you clocked the miles is super important.

I just get the nausea when there is a monthly payment involved.

Keep em comin guys...

njlou

I am not too sure that mileage is the issue. It is cost as mentioned above.

In the "old" days we had cars that were generally junk, and had moderate reliability. BUT they were cheap to fix and once fixed lasted very long until the next cheap fix.
Gas/service stations could handle ALL repairs and did a lot for free since they knew all their customers.
Enter today's hi-tech computer/EPA luxo machines and it is beyond the mere mechanic. They must be dealt with by the dealers and their computer download fixes. SO they charge dearly for all service.

You could keep a car (even a BMW) running forever, but it is the cost that makes it unreasonable. A generally minor repair (off warranty) is at least $1000. You are paying ~$150/hr labor and a random high price for parts. Even oil is a "special" magical fluid.

The dealers have a lock on their cars so you have little choice. You can minimize (a bit)by selecting a simpler model, and not beating on it so much.......but you will never do that.

So as the democrats say "make the wealthy pay".

DD_545i

You missed the point I made though. If you're buying a new car every 2-3 years, you're "paying" around $1000 a month in depreciation anyway. Try and sell a one year old ($50,000 when new) car for more than $40,000.

healthservices

That's where leasing is nice, If you can get the right deal you are only paying for depreciation, plus a fee. With free maintenance, there is no worries and you constantly get the latest and greatest. That is as long as you are ok with the monthly payment.

DD_545i

Aaah, I always forget about the leasers, I'm always a cash buyer.

The argument still holds true though. There are many that will pay let's say $800 a month on a lease because they feel that if they were to buy their dream car (e.g. 80's 635csi, 850i, E39 M5 etc) for 10-20k they'd be concerned about the risk of a big bill (like $2k here, $3k there), but unless they were getting lots of big bills like that, they're still winning in the fact that their car isn't depreciating much any more in value.

Of course, you don't need to go to the BMW dealer either. You only do that with newer cars under warranty. I got mine major serviced in November by my local two-man garage. They can order any parts they need from BMW and did the service indicators reset and everything. Cost me half the price of the dealer.