Uncomfortable armrest in drivers door
09-20-2006, 07:51 AM
#21
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My Ride: '04 545iS 6 spd, bought new via eBay, 11/05; Blk/Gry, Cold, L7, PDC, BMW Rear seatcover for pets.
First "Bumwa" was a new 1971 2002. High performance 5s since 1987. Beamer motorcycles too, currently on an 07 BMW K1200 GT; also a Moto Guzzi 1000 SP III.
During a long cruise-controlled ride (with an increasingly sore elbow), I studied the door panel design the other day, and as a few have pointed out, the problem is the SLOPE of the armrest: Counter-intuitively it RISES toward the back, from a low point at the front (where that hard wooden grab handle knocks the side of my knee).
I would estimate that the rear/highest point of the armrest is about 2 inches above its front edge. You combine this rising height with rearward adjustment of the seat for tall people, and presto: Tall guys are digging their elbow into a rest that is nearly 2 inches higher than its front end and at least 1 inch higher than it would be for median/normal-sized people. In other words, it forces us to "shrug" our left shoulder or dig in because of our relative seat position.
Combine this with the banging of my knee on the wooden door grip (that's too far forward for good leverage) and the catching of my left shoe's sole on the dead pedal as I clutch/shift, and you see why I have a nagging feeling that design has trumped function and therefore failed the BMW ergonomics legacy.
Bangle this,
Ray Hull
I would estimate that the rear/highest point of the armrest is about 2 inches above its front edge. You combine this rising height with rearward adjustment of the seat for tall people, and presto: Tall guys are digging their elbow into a rest that is nearly 2 inches higher than its front end and at least 1 inch higher than it would be for median/normal-sized people. In other words, it forces us to "shrug" our left shoulder or dig in because of our relative seat position.
Combine this with the banging of my knee on the wooden door grip (that's too far forward for good leverage) and the catching of my left shoe's sole on the dead pedal as I clutch/shift, and you see why I have a nagging feeling that design has trumped function and therefore failed the BMW ergonomics legacy.
Bangle this,
Ray Hull
let's see.........comfortable arm rests?? Don't they come standard on the Crown Victoria?
09-21-2006, 01:14 AM
#23
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On reading other posts, it would seem that a CIP upgrade would solve all problems 
Seriously though, i totally agree and i am constantly changing my driving position to find a more suitable one. I am 6'2" and always wear short sleaved tops.
Also, what i find really irritating (appart from the sloping armrest) is that the central armrest and door arm rest are NEVER the same height
Why is that? i often find that i am leaning over because with my two arms resting at different levels!
Oh well, keeps the chiropractors in business...
Seriously though, i totally agree and i am constantly changing my driving position to find a more suitable one. I am 6'2" and always wear short sleaved tops.
Also, what i find really irritating (appart from the sloping armrest) is that the central armrest and door arm rest are NEVER the same height
Why is that? i often find that i am leaning over because with my two arms resting at different levels!Oh well, keeps the chiropractors in business...
09-21-2006, 01:32 AM
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Originally Posted by Darron.Lowe' post='336943' date='Sep 21 2006, 10:14 AM
i often find that i am leaning over because with my two arms resting at different levels!
ABC
09-21-2006, 01:38 AM
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My Ride: -Current-
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Originally Posted by aybeesea' post='336955' date='Sep 21 2006, 10:32 AM
Try holding the steering wheel with at least one of them!
ABC
ABC
Thats just not comfy
With my arms on the arm rest i normally have both hands in the 20 to 4 position depending on where i decide to position my seat that day...
09-21-2006, 03:45 AM
#26
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Originally Posted by Ray Hull' post='326962' date='Aug 25 2006, 06:21 PM
First, Welcome Clement,
Second, please forgive the smart-ass non-responses that you sometimes get around here; some people can't control themselves, even when they have nothing to offer.
Third, I thoroughly agree with you. And, it is only compounded when wearing short sleeves and when you stick to the leather.
Unfortunately, this is something of a long-standing tradition/problem with BMWs. At least you don't have to endure the horrible posture (read: negative lumbar support) sport seats that I first encountered in my 87 535iS. I tried to improve on the comfort for long highway driving by having the dealer install a center armrest. Not only did it not work, it got in the way of shifting, even though it was very short.
Over the years and several 5 series, they have sometimes gotten better, (my 540S was decent), but still not perfeclty comfortable.
My main complaint about this door design is the diagonal wood-veneer grab handle that clashes with my knee. Combine that with the severly limited left-foot clutching space (I continually hit the dead pedal, even wearing narrow driving mocs) and this starts to be a fairly un-ergonomic design.
Frankly, I am surprised since BMW has always prided thiemselves on being ergonomicallly advanced, yet having everything fall to hand, rather naturally. I think this model has some serious shortcomings.
Cheers,
Ray Hull
Second, please forgive the smart-ass non-responses that you sometimes get around here; some people can't control themselves, even when they have nothing to offer.
Third, I thoroughly agree with you. And, it is only compounded when wearing short sleeves and when you stick to the leather.
Unfortunately, this is something of a long-standing tradition/problem with BMWs. At least you don't have to endure the horrible posture (read: negative lumbar support) sport seats that I first encountered in my 87 535iS. I tried to improve on the comfort for long highway driving by having the dealer install a center armrest. Not only did it not work, it got in the way of shifting, even though it was very short.
Over the years and several 5 series, they have sometimes gotten better, (my 540S was decent), but still not perfeclty comfortable.
My main complaint about this door design is the diagonal wood-veneer grab handle that clashes with my knee. Combine that with the severly limited left-foot clutching space (I continually hit the dead pedal, even wearing narrow driving mocs) and this starts to be a fairly un-ergonomic design.
Frankly, I am surprised since BMW has always prided thiemselves on being ergonomicallly advanced, yet having everything fall to hand, rather naturally. I think this model has some serious shortcomings.
Cheers,
Ray Hull
cheers
vern
09-21-2006, 04:14 AM
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ok...so the door arm rest isnt the comfortable among cars...
but it is the only one that extends beyond the door and on to the pillars...i have a heavy freind who drove my car and put the seat so much back his arms went to the pillars...he said he was finiding difficulty with his car "SUV" because of its small door armrest...
so its not so bad...does anybody know a car that does that cause i dont remmeber i know any others...
so its not so bad...
but it is the only one that extends beyond the door and on to the pillars...i have a heavy freind who drove my car and put the seat so much back his arms went to the pillars...he said he was finiding difficulty with his car "SUV" because of its small door armrest...
so its not so bad...does anybody know a car that does that cause i dont remmeber i know any others...
so its not so bad...
09-23-2006, 04:31 PM
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My Ride: '04 545iS 6 spd, bought new via eBay, 11/05; Blk/Gry, Cold, L7, PDC, BMW Rear seatcover for pets.
First "Bumwa" was a new 1971 2002. High performance 5s since 1987. Beamer motorcycles too, currently on an 07 BMW K1200 GT; also a Moto Guzzi 1000 SP III.
Originally Posted by vern' post='336978' date='Sep 21 2006, 07:45 AM
Ray with all your constant whining about BMW's through most of your posts I'm realy suprised you own a BMW or as many a you say you owned. I know things in real life can't be perfect but come on give us a break. ( hows my spelling?)
cheers
vern
cheers
vern
Sorry.
Ray Hull
09-24-2006, 03:58 AM
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2005 530i Titanium Gray,Black leather, Nav.,HUD,PP,CWP,SP,PDC,Xenon lights,Steptronic,Logic 7 sound system,,Fold down read seats,Power shades
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Originally Posted by Ray Hull' post='337897' date='Sep 23 2006, 08:31 PM
Gee Vern, still as vapid as ever, huh? Try understanding what I am saying before posting another of your snotty non-contributory replies. Or maybe, you are trying and just don't get it?
Sorry.
Ray Hull
Sorry.
Ray Hull
stand what you are saying and its first class whinning,( nit picking), you say it so much you probably don't even know your doing it, all the time about BMW's. I still believe with all your complaining about BMW's if you even own one and if you possibly do how can you enjoy it like so many of us do with your constant complaing about things being wrong or you don't like.
cheers
vern
PS Ray do you realy think my post are lackless ? I'll have to work on that.
09-24-2006, 09:06 AM
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I find the fit to be just perfect. I'm 6'2" and have a 36" sleeve length.
My elbow lands exactly on top of the rear edge of the arm rest, and the down-slope angle allows my forearm to lay comfortably on the pad in a totally relaxed position. My palm sits at the perfect spot so that I can wrap my hand around the handle (perfect for those hard left corners).
However, I may set up my driving position a bit differently than many of you. Even though I am relatively tall, I don't slide the seat all the way back. Instead, I lower the rear and raise the front of the seat bottom to gobble up legroom. I do rake back the seat back angle, but I raise the upper part of the backrest to be more vertical.
My left knee also sits exactly at the arm rest handle too, but I find this to be a benefit instead of a nuisance as the arm rest handle acts as a good brace in hard cornering.
All-in-all, the E60 offers the most perfect driving position I've ever experienced in any BMW. I have no complaints.
My elbow lands exactly on top of the rear edge of the arm rest, and the down-slope angle allows my forearm to lay comfortably on the pad in a totally relaxed position. My palm sits at the perfect spot so that I can wrap my hand around the handle (perfect for those hard left corners).
However, I may set up my driving position a bit differently than many of you. Even though I am relatively tall, I don't slide the seat all the way back. Instead, I lower the rear and raise the front of the seat bottom to gobble up legroom. I do rake back the seat back angle, but I raise the upper part of the backrest to be more vertical.
My left knee also sits exactly at the arm rest handle too, but I find this to be a benefit instead of a nuisance as the arm rest handle acts as a good brace in hard cornering.
All-in-all, the E60 offers the most perfect driving position I've ever experienced in any BMW. I have no complaints.