Software update = slower performance?
02-02-2009, 09:10 AM
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Has anyone heard this?
I was at a local chapter bmw club meet over the weekend, and was talking to a German dude that was a bmw tech in Germany, and he was saying that US software updates rob power. Don't know if there is any truth in it or if the guy was blowing smoke up my ass, but I did notice when I got my update a couple of months ago that it didn't seem as "peppy" after I picked it up.
I was at a local chapter bmw club meet over the weekend, and was talking to a German dude that was a bmw tech in Germany, and he was saying that US software updates rob power. Don't know if there is any truth in it or if the guy was blowing smoke up my ass, but I did notice when I got my update a couple of months ago that it didn't seem as "peppy" after I picked it up.
02-02-2009, 09:28 AM
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Im wondering the same thing. I just got a software updated and the car doesnt seem to wanna go as before...
Anyone else that can confirm this? Or I'm guessing could it be the ECU got reset and needs to relearn everything?
Anyone else that can confirm this? Or I'm guessing could it be the ECU got reset and needs to relearn everything?
02-02-2009, 09:58 AM
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Originally Posted by ktlocklear' post='783275' date='Feb 2 2009, 08:10 PM
Has anyone heard this?
I was at a local chapter bmw club meet over the weekend, and was talking to a German dude that was a bmw tech in Germany, and he was saying that US software updates rob power.
I was at a local chapter bmw club meet over the weekend, and was talking to a German dude that was a bmw tech in Germany, and he was saying that US software updates rob power.
This had to do with some specific early x35i models with the twin turbo gasoline engine.
There was some downgrading made do to emissions, but I suppose the problem is gone.
02-02-2009, 10:10 AM
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Originally Posted by Ricracing' post='783305' date='Feb 2 2009, 12:58 PM
Damned if I remember where I read about it, but it's true.
02-02-2009, 10:31 AM
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My Ride: 2010 VW Passat Wagon 2.0l Tsi
Grey/Grey Budapest 18"
Lost to HPFP issues:
08 535i sport pkg
Lost to Dreaded E61 Sun roof leaks:
07 E61 530Xi
No problem is still on going...
On the N54 motor there are issues with Waste gate rattle.... No performance issue there, but some people complained...
BMW put a software patch out ( DME version 29.2) that fundamentally changed how the waste gates operate.
old way = waste gates closed at engine idle, So minimal lag if you get on the gas... Great mileage, normal exhaust operation
29.2+ = Waste gates Open till 2800-3000 RPM, Low end lag that was not previously there, Between 1-5 MPG worse Gas mileage, Bad sounding exhaust, and eventually the waste gate rattle returns... Also BMW has added data logging to look for piggy backs and Flashes.
Soft ware revision 32.1 the Waste gate duty cycle is returned to normal, but BMW makes you aware that "Noise levels " will increase, the catch is that it is only on the "older" CPU's from lat 06 threw March 08 production. After March 08 production BMW claims that the way the engines are working from the factory is the way they will from now on... Laggy. The v81 CPU is not completable with the "Fix" for the lag.
There was no power loss up top , but more like the Power and torque bands changed since there was little to no boost down low. There have been a ton of comparisons in several of the 1 and 3 forums
This has been admitted in the Jan Roundel , and there have been several press releases about it. Some of the dealers have the new software , but most do not yet. All dealers should have the 32.1 software by the end of Feb. The E90/335 owners that do have the new non lag software , say that there cars finally perform either like the cars they test drove , or like there car was before the re flash. It only took about 1.2 years to get a fix for the lag induced by the software.
Most N54 owners got the software due to a mandatory flash when their HPFP failed ( which has on a lot of 1,3,5's and on some like mine 3x, this is the other elephant in the room right now). On the e90's there was also an issue with the steering wheel locks & the aux oil cooler on non sport packaged cars that needed a re flash.
On the N54 motor there are issues with Waste gate rattle.... No performance issue there, but some people complained...
BMW put a software patch out ( DME version 29.2) that fundamentally changed how the waste gates operate.
old way = waste gates closed at engine idle, So minimal lag if you get on the gas... Great mileage, normal exhaust operation
29.2+ = Waste gates Open till 2800-3000 RPM, Low end lag that was not previously there, Between 1-5 MPG worse Gas mileage, Bad sounding exhaust, and eventually the waste gate rattle returns... Also BMW has added data logging to look for piggy backs and Flashes.
Soft ware revision 32.1 the Waste gate duty cycle is returned to normal, but BMW makes you aware that "Noise levels " will increase, the catch is that it is only on the "older" CPU's from lat 06 threw March 08 production. After March 08 production BMW claims that the way the engines are working from the factory is the way they will from now on... Laggy. The v81 CPU is not completable with the "Fix" for the lag.
There was no power loss up top , but more like the Power and torque bands changed since there was little to no boost down low. There have been a ton of comparisons in several of the 1 and 3 forums
This has been admitted in the Jan Roundel , and there have been several press releases about it. Some of the dealers have the new software , but most do not yet. All dealers should have the 32.1 software by the end of Feb. The E90/335 owners that do have the new non lag software , say that there cars finally perform either like the cars they test drove , or like there car was before the re flash. It only took about 1.2 years to get a fix for the lag induced by the software.
Most N54 owners got the software due to a mandatory flash when their HPFP failed ( which has on a lot of 1,3,5's and on some like mine 3x, this is the other elephant in the room right now). On the e90's there was also an issue with the steering wheel locks & the aux oil cooler on non sport packaged cars that needed a re flash.
02-02-2009, 11:47 AM
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Originally Posted by schanE60' post='783358' date='Feb 2 2009, 12:41 PM
Does this apply to 550s too?
but it would seem possible on any bmw model for an SW update to down grade performance as the ecu is being re-programmed....
02-02-2009, 12:03 PM
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Originally Posted by GENEaTALS' post='783362' date='Feb 2 2009, 03:47 PM
no...just the x35i/n54 engine/ I6 + TT engine...
but it would seem possible on any bmw model for an SW update to down grade performance as the ecu is being re-programmed....
but it would seem possible on any bmw model for an SW update to down grade performance as the ecu is being re-programmed....
02-02-2009, 12:37 PM
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Originally Posted by bigbadbull' post='783324' date='Feb 2 2009, 02:31 PM
No problem is still on going...
On the N54 motor there are issues with Waste gate rattle.... No performance issue there, but some people complained...
BMW put a software patch out ( DME version 29.2) that fundamentally changed how the waste gates operate.
old way = waste gates closed at engine idle, So minimal lag if you get on the gas... Great mileage, normal exhaust operation
29.2+ = Waste gates Open till 2800-3000 RPM, Low end lag that was not previously there, Between 1-5 MPG worse Gas mileage, Bad sounding exhaust, and eventually the waste gate rattle returns... Also BMW has added data logging to look for piggy backs and Flashes.
Soft ware revision 32.1 the Waste gate duty cycle is returned to normal, but BMW makes you aware that "Noise levels " will increase, the catch is that it is only on the "older" CPU's from lat 06 threw March 08 production. After March 08 production BMW claims that the way the engines are working from the factory is the way they will from now on... Laggy. The v81 CPU is not completable with the "Fix" for the lag.
There was no power loss up top , but more like the Power and torque bands changed since there was little to no boost down low. There have been a ton of comparisons in several of the 1 and 3 forums
This has been admitted in the Jan Roundel , and there have been several press releases about it. Some of the dealers have the new software , but most do not yet. All dealers should have the 32.1 software by the end of Feb. The E90/335 owners that do have the new non lag software , say that there cars finally perform either like the cars they test drove , or like there car was before the re flash. It only took about 1.2 years to get a fix for the lag induced by the software.
Most N54 owners got the software due to a mandatory flash when their HPFP failed ( which has on a lot of 1,3,5's and on some like mine 3x, this is the other elephant in the room right now). On the e90's there was also an issue with the steering wheel locks & the aux oil cooler on non sport packaged cars that needed a re flash.
On the N54 motor there are issues with Waste gate rattle.... No performance issue there, but some people complained...
BMW put a software patch out ( DME version 29.2) that fundamentally changed how the waste gates operate.
old way = waste gates closed at engine idle, So minimal lag if you get on the gas... Great mileage, normal exhaust operation
29.2+ = Waste gates Open till 2800-3000 RPM, Low end lag that was not previously there, Between 1-5 MPG worse Gas mileage, Bad sounding exhaust, and eventually the waste gate rattle returns... Also BMW has added data logging to look for piggy backs and Flashes.
Soft ware revision 32.1 the Waste gate duty cycle is returned to normal, but BMW makes you aware that "Noise levels " will increase, the catch is that it is only on the "older" CPU's from lat 06 threw March 08 production. After March 08 production BMW claims that the way the engines are working from the factory is the way they will from now on... Laggy. The v81 CPU is not completable with the "Fix" for the lag.
There was no power loss up top , but more like the Power and torque bands changed since there was little to no boost down low. There have been a ton of comparisons in several of the 1 and 3 forums
This has been admitted in the Jan Roundel , and there have been several press releases about it. Some of the dealers have the new software , but most do not yet. All dealers should have the 32.1 software by the end of Feb. The E90/335 owners that do have the new non lag software , say that there cars finally perform either like the cars they test drove , or like there car was before the re flash. It only took about 1.2 years to get a fix for the lag induced by the software.
Most N54 owners got the software due to a mandatory flash when their HPFP failed ( which has on a lot of 1,3,5's and on some like mine 3x, this is the other elephant in the room right now). On the e90's there was also an issue with the steering wheel locks & the aux oil cooler on non sport packaged cars that needed a re flash.
So question...
I resolved all the hesitation issues I recently posted about with the dry gas...
My 535 is a 6/08 build. I would assume that it has the latter software you described.
I don't notice anything "laggy" about it. But, I haven't had a software update etc., so it may just be the way it is, and I don't know how much better it possibly could have been.
Where is peak boost produced in the 535? I do notice that I get what feels like more pull/torque in the 3500 and up range, but I don't feel that there is any turbo lag down low. It has great torque from 1200-1500.
Am I crazy, or do I just not know what the original 535s felt like?
02-02-2009, 01:31 PM
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My Ride: 2010 VW Passat Wagon 2.0l Tsi
Grey/Grey Budapest 18"
Lost to HPFP issues:
08 535i sport pkg
Lost to Dreaded E61 Sun roof leaks:
07 E61 530Xi
The original 135i( 50 or so made it state side with the older ECU before the change),335i's,535i's had like 90% torque at like 1800-2000 rpms.. this was with the older ecu and old software. The newer production ones the torque spools up much later say around 2800-3000 rpms.
The original power/torque graphs published by BMW were basically flat at 1800 rpms. I don't know if they have changed them, but on several dyno pulls the new software's power bands , and on the drag strip it is pretty obvious the differences, car length or two.
My car is much different than the day I drove it off the lot, and all the other N54's before I Got the E60. Don't get me wrong there is a lot of power, but I really miss the low end grunt it used to have.
There is a test that e90/87 drivers do , but it is harder to do with out a Sport/paddle or 6sp, where you get it in 4th gear at speed let off the gas, let the rpms drop to 1800 then hammer the gas immediately. This spool up time to get he power back is different with the 2 ecus and the different DME software. There are a bunch of U-tube videos ( I know not very scientific but you'll get the Idea) of the lag....
The original power/torque graphs published by BMW were basically flat at 1800 rpms. I don't know if they have changed them, but on several dyno pulls the new software's power bands , and on the drag strip it is pretty obvious the differences, car length or two.
My car is much different than the day I drove it off the lot, and all the other N54's before I Got the E60. Don't get me wrong there is a lot of power, but I really miss the low end grunt it used to have.
There is a test that e90/87 drivers do , but it is harder to do with out a Sport/paddle or 6sp, where you get it in 4th gear at speed let off the gas, let the rpms drop to 1800 then hammer the gas immediately. This spool up time to get he power back is different with the 2 ecus and the different DME software. There are a bunch of U-tube videos ( I know not very scientific but you'll get the Idea) of the lag....