High Speed Stability E60 Sports
11-28-2004, 08:22 AM
#11
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It is contributed to the aerodynamics, first off look at how much surface area the front bumper has for air to get trapped. I did not see and special plastic undertray which would create more frontal downforce like on a Porsche or Ferrari, very suprised, but I didnt observe it that much when I took a peek under the car.
Im not crusing at 140 guys, but once in a while its kinda cool and gives you a real rush. I remeber back in the days the first time I went over 140 on I87 I was in my 1992 S500 Benz it was a two ton tank and it was rock solid. The car handles terribly with nose dive and pitch but on the long straigh away it was great.
On the track the feeling is completely different, Ive had my share of drag racing as a kid on the 1/4 its just a huge rush.
Competition racing isnt about top speed man, its about endurance and driving skill, so dont mix them up.
The active steering does have a factor in this too, the electronic mechanism keeps altering the steering ratio, which as a result makes your steering wheel feel nervous.
Mr Urbo you are quite a negative boardmember and you do not even have your car yet, is the worse yet to come?
When you refer to accidents well in NY the dissasters are all caused mostly by Drunk Drivers and Kids trying to be Mario Andretti in there Dodge Neons and Civics, they clearly dont have a clue of the risk riding on those 14' rims with no thread since they are too ignorant to maintain there first cars.
I know how to control a car and never wil risk being stupid with passengers or in conditions that I feel are not safe.
Maybe I need to get used to the car some more but to be honest I dont think the stability will change for me, I get accustomed to any new car rather quick.
I am throwing on the AC Front spoiler and this week Im going to have the dealer dial in some more negative camber if they will and well see if this helps, I think it will.
Im not crusing at 140 guys, but once in a while its kinda cool and gives you a real rush. I remeber back in the days the first time I went over 140 on I87 I was in my 1992 S500 Benz it was a two ton tank and it was rock solid. The car handles terribly with nose dive and pitch but on the long straigh away it was great.
On the track the feeling is completely different, Ive had my share of drag racing as a kid on the 1/4 its just a huge rush.
Competition racing isnt about top speed man, its about endurance and driving skill, so dont mix them up.
The active steering does have a factor in this too, the electronic mechanism keeps altering the steering ratio, which as a result makes your steering wheel feel nervous.
Mr Urbo you are quite a negative boardmember and you do not even have your car yet, is the worse yet to come?
When you refer to accidents well in NY the dissasters are all caused mostly by Drunk Drivers and Kids trying to be Mario Andretti in there Dodge Neons and Civics, they clearly dont have a clue of the risk riding on those 14' rims with no thread since they are too ignorant to maintain there first cars.
I know how to control a car and never wil risk being stupid with passengers or in conditions that I feel are not safe.
Maybe I need to get used to the car some more but to be honest I dont think the stability will change for me, I get accustomed to any new car rather quick.
I am throwing on the AC Front spoiler and this week Im going to have the dealer dial in some more negative camber if they will and well see if this helps, I think it will.
11-28-2004, 08:34 AM
#12
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Originally Posted by urbo73' date='Nov 28 2004, 11:51 AM
Well maybe you got it, but the poster hasn't.
What is the point of YOUR post? NOTHING! Thanks clown.
What is the point of YOUR post? NOTHING! Thanks clown.
[snapback]61570[/snapback]
11-28-2004, 08:40 AM
#13
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Originally Posted by 2004RType' date='Nov 28 2004, 01:22 PM
It is contributed to the aerodynamics, first off look at how much surface area the front bumper has for air to get trapped. I did not see and special plastic undertray which would create more frontal downforce like on a Porsche or Ferrari, very suprised, but I didnt observe it that much when I took a peek under the car.
Im not crusing at 140 guys, but once in a while its kinda cool and gives you a real rush. I remeber back in the days the first time I went over 140 on I87 I was in my 1992 S500 Benz it was a two ton tank and it was rock solid. The car handles terribly with nose dive and pitch but on the long straigh away it was great.
On the track the feeling is completely different, Ive had my share of drag racing as a kid on the 1/4 its just a huge rush.
Competition racing isnt about top speed man, its about endurance and driving skill, so dont mix them up.
The active steering does have a? factor in this too, the electronic mechanism keeps altering the steering ratio, which as a result makes your steering wheel feel nervous.
Mr Urbo you are quite a negative boardmember and you do not even have your car yet, is the worse yet to come?
When you refer to accidents well in NY the dissasters are all caused mostly by Drunk Drivers and Kids trying to be Mario Andretti in there Dodge Neons and Civics, they clearly dont have a clue of the risk riding on those 14' rims with no thread since they are too ignorant to maintain there first cars.
I know how to control a car and never wil risk being stupid with passengers or in conditions that I feel are not safe.
Maybe I need to get used to the car some more but to be honest I dont think the stability will change for me, I get accustomed to any new car rather quick.
I am throwing on the AC Front spoiler and this week Im going to have the dealer dial in some more negative camber if they will and well see if this helps, I think it will.
Im not crusing at 140 guys, but once in a while its kinda cool and gives you a real rush. I remeber back in the days the first time I went over 140 on I87 I was in my 1992 S500 Benz it was a two ton tank and it was rock solid. The car handles terribly with nose dive and pitch but on the long straigh away it was great.
On the track the feeling is completely different, Ive had my share of drag racing as a kid on the 1/4 its just a huge rush.
Competition racing isnt about top speed man, its about endurance and driving skill, so dont mix them up.
The active steering does have a? factor in this too, the electronic mechanism keeps altering the steering ratio, which as a result makes your steering wheel feel nervous.
Mr Urbo you are quite a negative boardmember and you do not even have your car yet, is the worse yet to come?
When you refer to accidents well in NY the dissasters are all caused mostly by Drunk Drivers and Kids trying to be Mario Andretti in there Dodge Neons and Civics, they clearly dont have a clue of the risk riding on those 14' rims with no thread since they are too ignorant to maintain there first cars.
I know how to control a car and never wil risk being stupid with passengers or in conditions that I feel are not safe.
Maybe I need to get used to the car some more but to be honest I dont think the stability will change for me, I get accustomed to any new car rather quick.
I am throwing on the AC Front spoiler and this week Im going to have the dealer dial in some more negative camber if they will and well see if this helps, I think it will.
[snapback]61611[/snapback]
I've had faster cars and actually raced before (SCCA). And I've seen too many people drive at ridiculous speeds on public highways and roads in BMW, Porsches, etc. And get killed. So when I see posts like this, I call them out. Because even if you THINK you are in control, you are not. By your own admittance you weren't comfortable in the 545 at 120mph on a highway in NY. Even if you do become comfortable, you shouldn't be doing this regardless of passengers in the car or not or the road being empty. Public roads are not the place for suicide either.
Anyway, I don't think it's Active Steering to answer your point. And if you want to test it out and get comfortable, do it at the track. It's that simple.
I don't know why people see my posts as negtivity. I'm just pointing out the obvious. Unless this board is just for YES men.
11-28-2004, 08:42 AM
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Originally Posted by Flowerfred' date='Nov 28 2004, 12:47 PM
The point of my post was to try to tell you that the kind of negativity you displayed is not done here, and we like it that way.
There is another place, just for that..
There is another place, just for that..
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11-28-2004, 09:00 AM
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2004RType, I have driven the car at it's limit (155) for a short period and agree with you 100%.
I posted many months ago about the front end "floating". This seems to hapen north of 120-130
mph. To my surprise nobody was in agreement (or willing to agree/share). Someone did say
there was a reviewer that mentioned the same thing. INMH it is the lack of ground force
aerodynamics, and the "nervous" active steering combination. I wasn't scared but it was
definately twitchy enough to back down. Love the car, and at normal (65-85) and above normal
(100-120) ROCK SOLID.
As far as high speed driving.......well were I live there are also long stretches of very good
highway to let a 545 loose. The highway is divided by a forested median and well mantained.
I've done it at 3 or 4 am. when there is NOBODY on the roads (except for
Buford T. Justice) and if there was you would see them from a good enough distance to take
precautions. I would never endanger another driver or passengers life for my own thrill. I'm not
racing, I'm pushing my vehicle to it's upper limits, alone and content with a personal satisfaction
that I drive one of the top 10 saloons ever built.I only sieze the opportunity when all conditions
say go. The only one I'm endangering is myself, and hey it's my life and I live with no regrets.
I posted many months ago about the front end "floating". This seems to hapen north of 120-130
mph. To my surprise nobody was in agreement (or willing to agree/share). Someone did say
there was a reviewer that mentioned the same thing. INMH it is the lack of ground force
aerodynamics, and the "nervous" active steering combination. I wasn't scared but it was
definately twitchy enough to back down. Love the car, and at normal (65-85) and above normal
(100-120) ROCK SOLID.
As far as high speed driving.......well were I live there are also long stretches of very good
highway to let a 545 loose. The highway is divided by a forested median and well mantained.
I've done it at 3 or 4 am. when there is NOBODY on the roads (except for
Buford T. Justice) and if there was you would see them from a good enough distance to take
precautions. I would never endanger another driver or passengers life for my own thrill. I'm not
racing, I'm pushing my vehicle to it's upper limits, alone and content with a personal satisfaction
that I drive one of the top 10 saloons ever built.I only sieze the opportunity when all conditions
say go. The only one I'm endangering is myself, and hey it's my life and I live with no regrets.
11-28-2004, 09:49 AM
#16
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The 545 should be solid up to 120, but beyond that you will see lift and other aerodynamic effects starting to affect the stability. But I'm not sure why this is a surprise. The E60 is NOT a race car that's meant to be driven at 150 (or even 130/120 really), no matter what BMW may say - track or not. Look at how the body is built! Sure some will drive the wheels off of any car, but if you really want stability at 120+, then get an M3 GTR or M5 and go to the track where you can REALLY push it w/o risk to others.
You can choose to believe otherwise if you want though.
I still find it funny when people justify pushing the car to the limits on a public highway. No matter how much in control you may think you are, you can never be 100% sure. And it's not only your life you may be risking. At 3 or 4am driving at those speeds the chance of you seeing something well ahead of time makes me smile. To each his own..
You can choose to believe otherwise if you want though.
I still find it funny when people justify pushing the car to the limits on a public highway. No matter how much in control you may think you are, you can never be 100% sure. And it's not only your life you may be risking. At 3 or 4am driving at those speeds the chance of you seeing something well ahead of time makes me smile. To each his own..
11-29-2004, 04:56 AM
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My Ride: -04 530D
It seems that sleeknes and low Cw is not always good for stability. I was angry when I first time experienced swing at the front of truck I was passing. I thought there has to be something badly wrong! 
I don't know have I got used to it, but it's not so bad anymore. Also the stability when driven straight was little poor at first, IMHO. But all seem to be because car reacts so sharply to every wihs what driver makes.
Car is slow to response (Merc) or stiff (BMW) when some say it's nervous. Unstable turns easier! We just have get use to it.
Skaffa
PS. some don't use seatbelt, some drive fast, some with foglights...
I don't know have I got used to it, but it's not so bad anymore. Also the stability when driven straight was little poor at first, IMHO. But all seem to be because car reacts so sharply to every wihs what driver makes.
Car is slow to response (Merc) or stiff (BMW) when some say it's nervous. Unstable turns easier! We just have get use to it.
Skaffa
PS. some don't use seatbelt, some drive fast, some with foglights...
11-29-2004, 06:16 AM
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Originally Posted by urbo73' date='Nov 28 2004, 02:49 PM
The 545 should be solid up to 120, but beyond that you will see lift and other aerodynamic effects starting to affect the stability. But I'm not sure why this is a surprise. The E60 is NOT a race car that's meant to be driven at 150 (or even 130/120 really), no matter what BMW may say - track or not. Look at how the body is built! Sure some will drive the wheels off of any car, but if you really want stability at 120+, then get an M3 GTR or M5 and go to the track where you can REALLY push it w/o risk to others.
You can choose to believe otherwise if you want though.
I still find it funny when people justify pushing the car to the limits on a public highway. No matter how much in control you may think you are, you can never be 100% sure. And it's not only your life you may be risking. At 3 or 4am driving at those speeds the chance of you seeing something well ahead of time makes me smile. To each his own..
You can choose to believe otherwise if you want though.
I still find it funny when people justify pushing the car to the limits on a public highway. No matter how much in control you may think you are, you can never be 100% sure. And it's not only your life you may be risking. At 3 or 4am driving at those speeds the chance of you seeing something well ahead of time makes me smile. To each his own..
[snapback]61643[/snapback]
urbo73,
you are hijacking a thread with your personal agenda... Nobody asked you for your opinion on high speed driving. Please stick to the topic. This is what makes this board great, no flaming, no 'opinions', no politics, etc... Please keep it that way. It has nothing to do with bieng a 'YES' or 'NO' board; in this board most people stick to the topic at hand without expressing their personal opinions on irrelevant subjects.
Pablo
11-29-2004, 06:49 AM
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My Ride: 2008 550, Carbon Black Metallic, Natural Brown Dakota Leather, Sport Package, Sport Automatic Transmission, Cold Weather Package, Power Rear and Manual Side Sun Shades, etc.
Retired - 2004 545 SMG, Black Sapphire Metallic, Auburn Dakota Leather, Cold Weather and Sports Packages, Power Rear and Manual Side Sun Shades
I am not sure active steering is to blame. I would think - but am not sure - that at seome speed well less that the top sepeed the steering ratio hits its min/max and stops changing. In other words, the ration does not change at all from 120 - to top sepeed. Does anyone know for sure on this point?
11-29-2004, 07:22 AM
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My Ride: 2004 545i 6 spd Sports Package | NAV | PDC | Logic 7 | BT retrofit | SW V13.3
Originally Posted by robg' date='Nov 29 2004, 08:49 AM
I am not sure active steering is to blame. I? would think - but am not sure - that at seome speed well less that the top sepeed the steering ratio hits its min/max and stops changing.? In other words, the ration does not change at all from 120 - to top sepeed.? Does anyone know for sure on this point?
[snapback]61996[/snapback]
A slight undulation in the road or a cross wind will throw the car off at these speeds. If anything its the active suspension that may not be reading the need to harden itself because despite the speed you are still in a straight line.