530d (218bhp) vs 530d (231bhp)
01-13-2006, 03:48 AM
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Originally Posted by colejl' post='223638' date='Jan 13 2006, 09:22 AM
However, we're currently comparing an updated engine with an original engine. Lets compare the updated 530d with the updated 535d when (if) it comes along... 
well yes, but if you are buying now you know what to take... i told you
01-13-2006, 11:04 AM
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well yes, but if you are buying now you know what to take... i told you
[/quote]
Indeed! I'm very tempted by the new 530d... However, if I buy that I'll be all disappointed when the 290PS new 535d appears almost straight afterwards!!!
01-13-2006, 12:47 PM
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Originally Posted by colejl' post='223858' date='Jan 13 2006, 08:04 PM
tempted by the new 530d... However, if I buy that I'll be all disappointed when the 290PS new 535d appears almost straight afterwards!!!
i know what you mean mate, you can never be on the crest of car technology :thumbsdown:
6months and they release something new!
01-13-2006, 01:20 PM
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My Ride: 535D Sport Auto
The 530d 231bhp model may be almost as fast as the 535d may be even faster up to say 50mph but there's no way with just the single turbo that its going to be anywhere near up to 100mph. UK Autocar timed the 218hp model at 19.4secs 0-100mph and 15.0secs for the 535d. An increase of 13hp just won't do it. As far as I was concerned the introduction of the twin stage turbo 3.0 litre engine was to give similar standing start performance to the 530d but with the added benefit of petrol type performance right up to the redline. I'm not trying to start a diesel war its just that in my experience when I was driving above 70mph in my 530d and accelerating through the gears the car felt out of breath whereas in the 535d with the same senario it feels far more rapid. 530d is still a fantastic car. 
good point Merv ! ... but without starting a flame, i would like to invite you to go and drive the car . I really think you will be AMAZED. yes it wont do 0-100 in 15 but 16.5 max IMO... as i have tried explaining to many people MAX torque is not important here ... torque distribution is...
Try to superimpose the two lines and you will see what i mean:
lets start now
218bhp 530d vs 272bhp 530d
at 1600rpm both have around 80% of torque (530d:455nm, 535d: 525nm)
at 2000rpm both have around 100% of torque (530d:500nm, 535d: 560nm)
the 535d torque is almost flat to 4300rpm, whereas the 530d starts leveling at 3400rpm..
At 4500rpm the (530d:320nm, 535d:430nm) !! 530d has reached the rev line , 535d keeps on going
___ now lets start again
231bhp 530d vs 272 bhp
at 1600rpm 530d has 100% and 535d around 80% of torque (530d:515nm, 535d: 525nm)
at 2000rpm both have around 100% of torque (530d:520nm, 535d: 560nm)
at 4000rpm both have around 90% of torque (530d:410nm, 535d: 460-470nm)
the two torque curves are as follows : 535d flat curve from 2050rpm-4300 rpm
new 231bhp 530d flat curve 1650-4150rpm
so both are almost identical until 4300rpm, the 535d boost comes later and is slightly stronger,
but also finishes slighly later (but at 1650-2000rpm the 530d produces max torque)
And then the 2nd turbo does its job and allows the 535d to rev to 5000rpm, while the 530d has to change gear
Sorry for the long post but as you can see the two 530d engines are completely DIFFERENT... we are not talking about a 13bhp increase... we are talking about a wider more powerful torque curve
//// by flat curve i mean max torque throught
Originally Posted by OliverB' post='223466' date='Jan 12 2006, 10:56 PM
5. Is the gearbox final ratio still ideal with torque/power optimization ? Did you notice that 530d &535d have different ratios ? 
, the final drive ratios are clearly better on the 535d[/quote]
Ok I have read the figures but am I missing something here? The figures you quote for the 535d are higher than the uprated 530d in all cases. The torque curve may be wider than the previous 530d but it still drops away after 4,150rpm whereas the 535d keeps pulling right round to 5,000rpm. I still can't see why you would recommend the new 530d over the 535d. Ok the 530d has initial explosive acceleration but it would still appear that whilst driving at high speed the power falls away and even with another gear change you're still high up in the rev range without the pull. From my experience the 535d gives great acceleration whatever the revs or gear.
01-13-2006, 01:36 PM
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Originally Posted by Merv the Derv' post='223919' date='Jan 13 2006, 10:20 PM
Ok I have read the figures but am I missing something here? The figures you quote for the 535d are higher than the uprated 530d in all cases. The torque curve may be wider than the previous 530d but it still drops away after 4,150rpm whereas the 535d keeps pulling right round to 5,000rpm. I still can't see why you would recommend the new 530d over the 535d. Ok the 530d has initial explosive acceleration but it would still appear that whilst driving at high speed the power falls away and even with another gear change you're still high up in the rev range without the pull. From my experience the 535d gives great acceleration whatever the revs or gear.
Afterwards and until 4300ish rpm the 535d exhibits higher torque but not more than 30nm at most , compared to more than 100nm for the old 530d !
and yes it revs higher but look at the attachment... you would be better off upshifting!
i recommend ti because the new 530d with the new engine will cost cheaper, be cheaper to run and will have a higher residual value... and its almost as quick
01-14-2006, 01:15 AM
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Ok I have read the figures but am I missing something here? The figures you quote for the 535d are higher than the uprated 530d in all cases. The torque curve may be wider than the previous 530d but it still drops away after 4,150rpm whereas the 535d keeps pulling right round to 5,000rpm. I still can't see why you would recommend the new 530d over the 535d. Ok the 530d has initial explosive acceleration but it would still appear that whilst driving at high speed the power falls away and even with another gear change you're still high up in the rev range without the pull. From my experience the 535d gives great acceleration whatever the revs or gear.
Afterwards and until 4300ish rpm the 535d exhibits higher torque but not more than 30nm at most , compared to more than 100nm for the old 530d !
and yes it revs higher but look at the attachment... you would be better off upshifting!
i recommend ti because the new 530d with the new engine will cost cheaper, be cheaper to run and will have a higher residual value... and its almost as quick
[/quote]
I guess the slightly less weight must help too? Also with the handling...?
Hmmm, perhaps I might visit my dealer for try... But the updated 535d will be awesome! (Remember that they're all awesome already...
)
01-14-2006, 11:45 AM
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Originally Posted by colejl' post='224064' date='Jan 14 2006, 10:15 AM
I guess the slightly less weight must help too? Also with the handling...?
Hmmm, perhaps I might visit my dealer for try... But the updated 535d will be awesome! (Remember that they're all awesome already... )
Hmmm, perhaps I might visit my dealer for try... But the updated 535d will be awesome! (Remember that they're all awesome already...
)
01-14-2006, 12:13 PM
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[/quote]
YES!!!
01-18-2006, 01:39 PM
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My Ride: F11 520d white, auto, professional sat-nav with internet, variable damper control, sports steering wheel, extended lighting, retractable tow bar, wing mirrors with dimming & folding, full electric seats with memory & lumber adjustment, etc.
I have the new engined 530d and a work collegue has the ealier car. He tried my car in the real world driving experiance out there on the road with no torque curve charts and said he was amazed at the difference. He said it was quieter also.
01-18-2006, 01:51 PM
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Originally Posted by Nova Invicta' post='226122' date='Jan 18 2006, 10:39 PM
I have the new engined 530d and a work collegue has the ealier car. He tried my car in the real world driving experiance out there on the road with no torque curve charts and said he was amazed at the difference. He said it was quieter also.